Politics : What does consent mean w/ sex in the MeToo movement?

He makes some excellent points.

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"When you want to help people, you tell them the truth. When you want to help yourself, you tell them what they want to hear"–Thomas Sowell

What the metoo movement is all about:

"I slept with you and didn't get the part! HARASSMENT!"

Yep. That's part of it.

Also, having sex and then regretting it at some point, whether it's the next day or 20 years later. Apparently that's also considered non-consensual sex. *smdh*

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"When you want to help people, you tell them the truth. When you want to help yourself, you tell them what they want to hear"–Thomas Sowell

To play devils advocate, the amount of folks who withdrawal consent later due to regret or embarrassment are very few.

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Can't we all just get along?

There's a very high profile one going on right now.

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"When you want to help people, you tell them the truth. When you want to help yourself, you tell them what they want to hear"–Thomas Sowell

and when that person is you, you probably aren't thinking of statistics.

I'm glad I'm old and past that stuff.

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https://www.scribd.com/document/382737647/MortSahlFan-Song-List

#FreeWeinstein

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My password is password

Warren, please

That right there is why you're a bitch. A flat assed bitch!

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My password is password

A fat assed bitch!

Fixed it!

Something I dont have a clue about.

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Without strife, your victory has no meaning.
Without strife, you do not advance.
Without strife, there is only stagnation.

I don't think he really answered her question though, he basically said ban alcohol and don't be promiscuous! The idea that we are still learning how to have sexual freedom after the advent of birth control is daft imo because we have had 60+ years of the pill and most generations since have grown up with that as the norm.

It's a tough question and it is difficult to see how to approach this without either branding all men as rapists or women as sluts. That's incredibly insulting to both sexes. We need common sense.

I take his point that people make dumb decisions regarding sex when alcohol is concerned, however regretting sex and withdrawing consent after a drunken encounter isn't as straightforward as he suggests. For example two drunk people deciding to get it on is just that, one sober person taking advantage of a drunk person is an abuse of power and a dick move. A slightly intoxicated person can probably consent, a heavily intoxicated person not so much. It's not black and white but I guess most people would chalk it up to experience and move on.

I still think that metoo was a good thing, it brought down the Weinsteins of the world and encouraged conversation on the subject of consent and rape. I'd suggest that most women have had a sexual encounter where they felt coerced or that there was no way out of a situation due to fear of consequences or worse, their safety. They may have felt that sex was an uncomfortable price to pay for making a naive and regrettable decision (like a meeting in a hotel room). Metoo gave us the power to understand that it's okay to walk away from those situations and might have made a few predatory males think twice before wielding their power to obtain sexual favours.

Sluts that should stay away from men.

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Norman! What did you put in my tea?

I take his point that people make dumb decisions regarding sex when alcohol is concerned, however regretting sex and withdrawing consent after a drunken encounter isn't as straightforward as he suggests. For example two drunk people deciding to get it on is just that, one sober person taking advantage of a drunk person is an abuse of power and a dick move. A slightly intoxicated person can probably consent, a heavily intoxicated person not so much. It's not black and white but I guess most people would chalk it up to experience and move on.

Yes. With this, I completely agree. Many of us have had experiences where we looked back and thought, wtf? Oh hell, no. But again, that is regret, not rape. I also agree with you that the lines get blurry because nothing in the world is black and white, and we try to make it so, we create division and anger.

For proof of that, look at what MeToo has done. While yes, it absolutely has put some men on notice, such as Weinstein and Epstein, and it's helping to remind women we have agency over our bodies, we now have women out there who have weaponized it to the point that they're using it to manipulate men. We've always had agency but perhaps thanks to MeToo, many women feel more empowered to be reminded of it.

When I look around now, I know many men are afraid of even approaching a woman for fear she's a foot soldier simply looking for an excuse to start a fire. Not all women, but enough. All it takes is "enough" to make a damaging impact to innocent men, and not just the men who are actually guilty. These women are trying men and accusing them on TikTok, FB, Insta or whatever, and they're being tried by social media and not a court of law and being cancelled.

That is not what MeToo was set up to do. We, as society, seem to have forgotten "innocent until proven guilty" and that includes a man who may have glanced at you for 2 seconds.

I don't believe Peterson advocates for abolishing alcohol. He's simply stating that it impairs judgment; which it does. If you don't know how much liquor you can handle are afraid of going beyond your threshold, you also need to take responsibility for your drinking actions. No one ever talks about responsibility. It's all about blame.

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"When you want to help people, you tell them the truth. When you want to help yourself, you tell them what they want to hear"–Thomas Sowell

I still don't understand why metoo created so much hostility in some men. One would expect outrage that monsters like Weinstein and Crosby were wielding their power to rape women, instead what we got was rape apologists who got deep into victim blaming. You know the sort of thing, why was she there, what was she expecting and why didn't she tell anyone until now?

I know that there are women who cry rape and that's appalling. As I said it is a tricky subject and nobody ought to be tried by social media. In an ideal world all parties would remain anonymous until a court case but that's becoming more difficult by the day. The problem is people can be toxic and use sex as a weapon, both sexes do it.

I'm just very wary of returning to a time when women are blamed for their attack because of their sexual history or how they were dressed or even naively going to a meeting in a hotel room. You can see by the comments on this board that some men get very angry when a woman accuses a powerful man of sexual assault, because of course Trump would never do that…

I'm all for women taking personal responsibility because although it isn't all men who rape there are enough creeps out there that most women seem to have at least one horror story. With that said about personal responsibility, it has to apply to men too, they don't have to get a written contract or anything but just use their common sense, if a woman looks like she is feeling uncomfortable then you need to extricate yourself from the situation for both your sakes.

👆👍

i'm not gonna engage in this discussion, but still, thank you for this.

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the sound of your racing heart

I agree with all of this. MeToo put a "notice" out there that there's not going to be a "casting couch" anymore, and that as women, we expect to be treated with respect. When it comes to getting a job, we get it based on our skills, not if we have sex with the boss or what we look like.

The behaviour of men like Cosby, Weinstein, Epstein and the like, is abhorrent and reprehensible. It's inexcusable. What makes it even more disgusting is that they had teams of handlers who enabled the behaviour and silenced the women from speaking out, or downright ruined their careers (or even prevented them from getting launched). People like Epstein, they're predators who seek out vulnerable girls, usually with a history of trauma, which means they're more apt to be malleable and impressionable.

Parents also need to raise their kids to be able to read social skills before society eventually does demand written contracts. Maybe even teach this in school instead of teaching kids about transitioning? Just a thought, - kind of like teaching them how to balance their bank account, manage their finances, and return to education, not indoctrination. Between home and school, we have the ability to teach kids early on about boundaries.

We, both men and women, should have the freedom to flirt or ask for sex, and likewise, have the exact same freedom to say, "no," and walk away without fear of repercussion. Agency and responsibility for both parties.

The thing is, what I'm seeing hitting the headlines the most, is the weaponization of MeToo and trial by social media. These are the things I'm upset about because peoples' lives are being ruined based on hearsay and not legal proceedings and police reports. We'd be foolish if we didn't acknowledge that there are women who do manipulate men and then twist the situation if they don't get their way because the man doesn't fall for their act.

I believe both men and women deserve the same respect and right to agency, privacy, and "innocent until proven guilty." Both men and women need to learn social skills, and responsibility includes accepting it for oneself, and an offender being punished for doing so.

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"When you want to help people, you tell them the truth. When you want to help yourself, you tell them what they want to hear"–Thomas Sowell

I could be wrong but I think the issues surrounding consent probably are taught in schools.

The thing is, what I'm seeing hitting the headlines the most, is the weaponization of MeToo and trial by social media. These are the things I'm upset about because peoples' lives are being ruined based on hearsay and not legal proceedings and police reports. We'd be foolish if we didn't acknowledge that there are women who do manipulate men and then twist the situation if they don't get their way because the man doesn't fall for their act.

I can't comment much further on this since I'm not much of a social media user so I'm not really aware of the stories to which you're referring. As I said previously fake rape reporting is appalling.

I think in general metoo was less about women getting justice and more about women finally having the voice and the courage to say "that also happened to me".

I think in general metoo was less about women getting justice and more about women finally having the voice and the courage to say "that also happened to me".

This is incredibly powerful and healing. After any type of trauma, to not feel alone, and to also help survivors understand the irony of shame that comes with it. Why are we ashamed of being violated? That's warped. Look at cultures that still punish women for being raped. Having any type of group that supports healing from trauma is healthy. That aspect, I fully support.

For reference, I have no social media accounts, so when I refer to seeing them, the incidents have become so frequent and gained so much momentum, they have migrated into the mainstream.

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"When you want to help people, you tell them the truth. When you want to help yourself, you tell them what they want to hear"–Thomas Sowell

I still don't understand why metoo created so much hostility in some men.

Because there was a presumption of guilt and men were having their careers ruined without any evidence. It was an outrage.

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My password is password

^

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"I am Kamala Harris, my pronouns are she and her, and I am a woman sitting at the table wearing a blue suit." -A fucking idiot

In the Weinstein case which kicked off the metoo movement I agree he was presumed guilty and in my post I say a few times that false reports of rape are appalling.

Weinstein was however tried and convicted.

Edited to add:

Sometimes where there is a lot of smoke there's also a huge fire and many people used their "outrage" to express disdain that men like that had been getting away with rape for decades. Metoo had to happen to bring about change.

Being tried and convicted means nothing. Men have been tried and convicted on false rape charges many times. Weinstein was declared guilty by the public before he even went to trial. It is hard to believe that and societal pressure from the metoo movement didn't have any impact on the jury's decision.

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My password is password

It wasn't ideal and I do take your point but do you think he ought he to have remained a free man? What would have been an alternative way of dealing with the situation?

It wasn't just Weinstein, they created the demand of "Believe All Women." It was ridiculous, that's what people had issue with. Or how SJWs claim regret sex is rape, or if both parties are drunk and consent it means the man raped the woman.

Or like when that chick who accused Aziz Ansari of sexual abuse even though when they were fooling around she even said that when she asked him to stop he stopped immediately but she claimed "He should have recognized my non-verbal cues before that." What the fuck is that? It's obvious even according to her telling of it he did nothing wrong, didn't matter, they still came after him.

But overall leftist SJWs broadened the meaning of rape or sexual assault/abuse so much it means nothing, and Democrats turned this into a political weapon.

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"I am Kamala Harris, my pronouns are she and her, and I am a woman sitting at the table wearing a blue suit." -A fucking idiot

they created the demand of "Believe All Women." It was ridiculous, that's what people had issue with.

I think victims of sexual assault must be believed in the first instance, it's the only way to proceed with an investigation. Do you want to return to a time when women are blamed for their rape or they never report for fear of being disbelieved?
Imagine, if you can, yourself in a situation where you have been raped and when you report it you're met with the attitude that you're an unreliable witness because some other people have lied about rape so everyone must be a liar.

Or how SJWs claim regret sex is rape, or if both parties are drunk and consent it means the man raped the woman.

Is that really a thing though? Have their been cases where a woman claiming regret sex as rape has resulted in a conviction?

As I said in a previous post there's a difference between a sober person who takes advantage of a highly intoxicated person and two drunk people having sex.

Aziz Ansari

I'm not aware of this case but going by what you said he did the right thing. No further action necessary.

I'm a realist, I know there are shitty women out there who use rape accusations to create havoc in a man's life and I find it despicable.

The pendulum often swings too far in one direction and it seems either way one sex has the potential to be crucified. If there's a middle ground where common sense reigns I welcome it.

I think victims of sexual assault must be believed in the first instance, it's the only way to proceed with an investigation. Do you want to return to a time when women are blamed for their rape or they never report for fear of being disbelieved?
Imagine, if you can, yourself in a situation where you have been raped and when you report it you're met with the attitude that you're an unreliable witness because some other people have lied about rape so everyone must be a liar.

Disagree, I'm not saying deny them or accused them of lying, but to just blindly believe it is ridiculous. Take the accusations serious, listen to them, investigate and go from there. Don't just immediately believe any accusation, that sets a very dangerous precedent.

Is that really a thing though? Have their been cases where a woman claiming regret sex as rape has resulted in a conviction?

No, not in a legal sense, but in the current social climate of the #MeToo movement it's been used plenty of times to destroy people's lives. That's a big issue with this radical movement, the SJWs hate men(and white people and straight people and in-shape people and Christians and themselves) so they target people and find ways to "cancel" them with this nonsense.

As I said in a previous post there's a difference between a sober person who takes advantage of a highly intoxicated person and two drunk people having sex.

Agreed.

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"I am Kamala Harris, my pronouns are she and her, and I am a woman sitting at the table wearing a blue suit." -A fucking idiot

I think victims of sexual assault must be believed in the first instance

no, they shouldn't be believed. It should be like every other investigation where the accused is considered innocent until proven guilty. Presuming guilt is how you taint investigations and is when injustice happens.

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My password is password

So, do you propose all alleged victims of crime be treated as liars? Burglary victims? Assault victims?

No one should be treated as a liar but their allegations shouldn't be taken as fact no matter the crime alleged. Justice is meant to be blind. The accusations should be investigated without any prejudice. As for burglary, it is usually a crime that usually involves significant amount of evidence and the perpetrator is discovered through an investigation. Sexual assault allegations often involve no evidence and is a matter of he said/she said. No one's life should be ruined based on an unprovable allegation.

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My password is password

I dont know who that is but somehow is on my blocklist, which goes to show he’s an idiot!, predictably you agree. Thanks for the quote reply otherwise I wouldnt even know. The Only thing I agree with is that it’s a Dick Move!

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Without strife, your victory has no meaning.
Without strife, you do not advance.
Without strife, there is only stagnation.

What's been happening are situations like this. As a trainer, we're taught to always watch other people in the gym, even in our peripheral vision, in case something happens. Watch the whole video, watch her body language, and tell me that she's not intentionally setting this personal trainer up. She's not there to work out. She's there for attention. And hey, whatever, if she needs to get her attention needs met by strange men at the gym, whatever dude, but once she started in attacking this personal trainer and getting in his face rude, she went too far. This could have been handled so much better.




Meanwhile, SHE is the one recording the faces of two people who did not consent to being filmed and putting it out on the internet, stating that they are "creeps." How do you think that makes them feel, or their wives and kids?

Meanwhile, she's posing and shaking her ass, not working out. This is to what I refer when I talk about toxic females ruining it for decent men who aren't doing anything wrong. She lost her membership and got booted for trespassing by the way.

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"When you want to help people, you tell them the truth. When you want to help yourself, you tell them what they want to hear"–Thomas Sowell

This girl’s a narcissistic jerkoff. She orchestrated the entire standoff.

If you’re filming in public and dressed like that, posing like that, guys will look. So will girls. People will notice you because you’re attractive. I don’t think the trainer was even looking for long before she accused him of perving. Also for her to accuse him means she was watching him. What a huge asshole she is.

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Please take your meds.

Lilith always sides with old fashioned conservative male chauvinist point of views against female victims regarding sexual misconduct, sexual assault, domestic violence, drug/alcohol assisted sexual assault.

And you’re a fagot!

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Without strife, your victory has no meaning.
Without strife, you do not advance.
Without strife, there is only stagnation.

So is Lilith.

Lilith is a dude?

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Without strife, your victory has no meaning.
Without strife, you do not advance.
Without strife, there is only stagnation.

OMG! Wait, what? I'm a dude?

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"When you want to help people, you tell them the truth. When you want to help yourself, you tell them what they want to hear"–Thomas Sowell

Thought so!
Thanks for clarifying, Princess.

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Without strife, your victory has no meaning.
Without strife, you do not advance.
Without strife, there is only stagnation.

Jorden Peterson

I'll stop you there…

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My password is password

Means that even if she says yes you are still a rapist because the left is fucking insane.

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"An armed man is a free man. An unarmed man is a fool. A disarmed man is a slave."

That’s probably how your mom had you.

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Without strife, your victory has no meaning.
Without strife, you do not advance.
Without strife, there is only stagnation.

Wipe your nose before you talk to me. Ya got biden shit all over it.

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"An armed man is a free man. An unarmed man is a fool. A disarmed man is a slave."

Dont spit Trumps cum on my face. Dont forget to swallow it, and leave room for the second cumming of Ronny FromSatan.

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Without strife, your victory has no meaning.
Without strife, you do not advance.
Without strife, there is only stagnation.

You don't even know who you are talking to.

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"An armed man is a free man. An unarmed man is a fool. A disarmed man is a slave."

You’re right, a Nobody!

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Without strife, your victory has no meaning.
Without strife, you do not advance.
Without strife, there is only stagnation.

You are tossing out insults blind that are tailored for someone else. You fail.

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"An armed man is a free man. An unarmed man is a fool. A disarmed man is a slave."

You fail to see that suit suits you fine.

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Without strife, your victory has no meaning.
Without strife, you do not advance.
Without strife, there is only stagnation.

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"An armed man is a free man. An unarmed man is a fool. A disarmed man is a slave."

That makes no sense.
It’s great to know that we live

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Without strife, your victory has no meaning.
Without strife, you do not advance.
Without strife, there is only stagnation.