Split : My girlfriend thinks the movie was trying to "relax" us sexually

What I mean by this is that during the scenes with the girls removing their clothes, my girlfriend instantly points out how this isn't necessary to the plot other than to arouse male attention. Then when the villain, under his child-like persona, woke up spooning the teen girl and it appeared she didn't mind it followed by the creep wanting a kiss from her and the teen girl didn't object, my girlfriend started groaning pretty loudly which had gotten a few looks from the audience.

Anyway, we discussed the movie in detail afterwards, and to make a long story short, she keeps insisting that the director wanted to "relax" us by insinuating mild pedophilia. I strongly disagree because the characters are portrayed as late teens so that term doesn't apply, but my girlfriend insists it does from an abstract standpoint with showing all the skin on the girls and getting much older men distracted and interested in it.

Then she asks me if I found any of these "young" girls attractive, while giving me that "look" which I then had to steer the topic off course without a reply.

My girlfriend keeps insisting to me that she's seeing this phenomenon more and more in movies, but they're subtle, in the same way Hollywood used to do with the gay themes, in an attempt to get the audience comfortable. I'm interested in opinions on this subject. Does she have a point?

Man stories like this make me so happy I'm gay.


Less than forget. But more than begun.

ditto

---

Man stories like this make me so happy I'm gay.

---

I'm also gay and I agree

Gay here too. We're not immune to visual cues, but holy cow, that's pretty extensive




______________________________________
And I stepped on the ping pong ball!

What would her point have been? I don't see how getting men aroused is going to relax us.
And these girls are all in their 20s so they might be young but they're not inappropriate.
So unless anyone was aroused by the flashback scenes with the uncle they're ok.

I was aroused by the scene when the uncle took off his clothes and got on all fours and acted like an animal.

i was waiting for Raylan givens to come shoot him in the face.

No. The sexualization of the girls in the movie is used as character development for Dennis. He is very attracted to young girls to the extent that he is willing to do morally questionable things just to get a taste, ergo kidnapping the girls. Having them remove their clothes for "cleanliness" and the shots where the camera fixates on the girls are supposed to reflect Dennis' current mindset, as he is constantly battling his inner demons.
The girl waking up with the man in bed was meant to be a shock factor for both the audience and the girl, and upon learning it is merely Hedwig is supposed to be relief, some even consider it comical. The girl is very passive and keeps to herself, so it would have been out of character for her to freak out. She was DEFINITELY not okay with him in the bed, that's where I disagree with your girlfriend most.

Movies are about telling stories and observing character development. Any pedophilia your girlfriend sees is merely due to her overlooking how those scenes affect the characters and why they are important to the overall storyline and theme

Split, like its villain, is conflicted. The prolonged semi-nudity of the film's teenage characters does feel more than a little exploitative, particularly if we assume that it reflects and caters to that infamous boogeyman, the objectifying male gaze. But it's equally reasonable to imagine that we, as viewers, are meant to identify with Casey, Marcia & Claire. In that case, their deshabille and forced sexualization become effective horror elements, boosting our sense of vulnerability & distress in an already bad cinematic situation. Nor are these mutually exclusive options. I'd say that Split both objectifies and encourages identification with Kevin's young captives.

Okay, but does it normalize pedophilia? Hell no! The scenes with inappropriately sexual overtones are all constructed to maximize the skin-crawling creeps, and the narrative devotes substantial story space to an affecting portrait of the scars of childhood sexual abuse. Nevertheless, I do understand where your girlfriend is coming from, snparks. Shyamalan goes out of his way to strip his younger female castmembers to their underwear and keep them there. He even pops in to personally endorse the joys of leering during his cameo as the screen-watching "Hooters Lover".

As a straight guy, I find Jessica Sula quite attractive. I very much enjoyed the time she spent trucking around in her smalls. In watching Split, I had no idea how old the actress really was. I knew only that she was playing an adolescent and, whatever her actual age, is certainly far too young for the likes of me. The film's clear invitation to ogle struck me as deliberately (if mildly) transgressive. "Look," Shyamalan seems to say. "Here is a hot young high school girl. Please stare at her body. I'm in charge here, and I give you my permission." The self-conscious edginess of the gesture struck me as weird, especially given the film's basic tameness.

Holy fudge youre boring. All this time, then, youve been anxious about your own feelings of wanting the black chick?

Your film gods: Lee Van Cleef and Laura Gemser
http://tinyurl.com/pa4ud44

Nah, I thought she was hot. That part didn't bother me at all. Nor did anything about the film, really, though it was a bit long.

---

Split, like its villain, is conflicted. The prolonged semi-nudity of the film's teenage characters does feel more than a little exploitative, particularly if we assume that it reflects and caters to that infamous boogeyman, the objectifying male gaze. But it's equally reasonable to imagine that we, as viewers, are meant to identify with Casey, Marcia & Claire. In that case, their deshabille and forced sexualization become effective horror elements, boosting our sense of vulnerability & distress in an already bad cinematic situation. Nor are these mutually exclusive options. I'd say that Split both objectifies and encourages identification with Kevin's young captives.

Okay, but does it normalize pedophilia? Hell no! The scenes with inappropriately sexual overtones are all constructed to maximize the skin-crawling creeps, and the narrative devotes substantial story space to an affecting portrait of the scars of childhood sexual abuse. Nevertheless, I do understand where your girlfriend is coming from, snparks. Shyamalan goes out of his way to strip his younger female castmembers to their underwear and keep them there. He even pops in to personally endorse the joys of leering during his cameo as the screen-watching "Hooters Lover".

As a straight guy, I find Jessica Sula quite attractive. I very much enjoyed the time she spent trucking around in her smalls. In watching Split, I had no idea how old the actress really was. I knew only that she was playing an adolescent and, whatever her actual age, is certainly far too young for the likes of me. The film's clear invitation to ogle struck me as deliberately (if mildly) transgressive. "Look," Shyamalan seems to say. "Here is a hot young high school girl. Please stare at her body. I'm in charge here, and I give you my permission." The self-conscious edginess of the gesture struck me as weird, especially given the film's basic tameness.

---

Teenagers are almost never played by actual teenagers. They're usually in their early twenties.

Yes. I know.

Your girlfriend sounds insecure. Go see movies by yourself from now on.

I mean Are you sure she's not just seeing what she wants to see? I agree that it seems like Hollywood is okay with overly sexualizing women, more than men, but that didn't seem to be the case here. Casey looked plenty uncomfortable and freaked out by both the spooning and the "kiss" to me. And I thought it was pretty clear she didn't reject the "kiss" because she was trying to be patient and get Hedwig to take her up to his room.

Completely agreeing with this.

OP, I don't get the sense that your gf is one with whom you can have a logical conversation on these matters.

What kind of groaning and moaning we talking about??

God Damn! We just had a near-life experience, fellas.

This is gold. Can we be friends?

God Damn! We just had a near-life experience, fellas.

16 is the age of consent in most US states and the world at large.

While I don't think the movie relaxed the tention it was an obvious sexual ploy. Girls are hot, what's the complaint?

People just have this random grab bag of stuff they worry about, like the old Victorians. Like they used to write dead as dd in books, or get really bent out of shape if someone farted. Anything that could possibly relate to womens bodies, for one, is a HUGE no-no to show, discuss, look at, etc unless you make a big show of disclaimers while youre doing it to let everyone know your on the right side.

Your film gods: Lee Van Cleef and Laura Gemser
http://tinyurl.com/pa4ud44

Some of you have made valid points. I tried to explain to her that there's no emphasis on pedophilia in this movie. If anything, it showed the harmful effects of child abuse with scenes from the little girl and her disgusting uncle; and those were only hinted at, not displayed.

To the poster that said my girlfriend is insecure, I think you make a strong point as I did notice her obvious discomfort during the scenes of the girls removing parts of their clothes. My girlfriend kept shooting "looks" at me and they weren't very good ones.

Girls who don't want their boyfriends to even look at other women, even women in movies, is a sign that she's probably a little too possessive for this relationship to be sustainable. Are you expected to cover your eyes like a child at the first sign of female skin? That's ridiculous, man.

Television is a vice; film is an addiction.

Sounds like you need a new girlfriend.

Whatever you do, don't tell her about "the internet"! I was shocked the other day when a friend told me they have a thing on there called "pornography" and that the main focus of these purveyors of perversion is actually young, attractive women! Disgraceful.

Yea she's a bit on the immature side; ignoring my texts and then when I try to move away from her today she calls me a man-whore and claims she'll never introduce me to any of her parents. We've only been together about 5 months so I'm going to be fading off on her in a little bit. I never knew she was this insecure? My sister told me at the family Christmas party that a girl who keeps changing her hair color every week and pressing me on if I like it reeks insecurity. Now the thing with the movie? I don't need this.

sounds like she needs to relax sexually. I bet the girls in this film easily top 100 sexual partners combined.

---

I bet the girls in this film easily top 100 sexual partners combined.

---

God, people on the internet say such dumb sht.


Less than forget. But more than begun.

ah, right, we're all conservatives now thanks to trump. I will revise to say 50 combined. and if you think I am wrong you are insanely naive.

Gross AND stupid. Nice work.

Your right .dump her you need a chick who will unzip your fly durning scenes like this blow you instead .

God Damn! We just had a near-life experience, fellas.

The fact that your girlfriend "groaned loudly" in the theater is the most egregious part of this whole thread

That is exactly what I thought too.

Your girlfriend is dumb and insecure

Yes she's insecure but hardly dumb. Having a Bachelor's degree in Education hardly makes anyone "dumb" so I will wisely disregard the unneeded insults.

I spoke to her last night, after not talking for a few days because she was annoyed with me, suggested we go and give the movie another shot to see if we can have a different kind of experience and she graciously declined. When I asked why, she simply said she isn't in to what "we" guys are into. Huh?

Anyway, I think this film can use multiple viewings. It's that kind of movie. It has some nuances and other plot points that can be further explored. Anyone else agree with that?

She can be the most intelligent being on this planet, her opinions are still dumb. At least those you told us about.

your girlfriend is just stupid. Leave her. Do NOT marry her.

What's with all these personal immature attacks?! I'm trying to bring the topic back to the movie at hand and I get greeted with this nonsense?

Okay I'm sorry , I deleted it , was not serious

God Damn! We just had a near-life experience, fellas.

I think the only point that needs to be made here is that you should think about finding a new girlfriend as she is only going to get more and more angry as she gets older, especially when other guys are saying nice things about girls younger than her. She sounds like a nightmare. Run now!

Call her over and watch Black Swan in bed together .. maybe some good dyke action will lube her up
God Damn! We just had a near-life experience, fellas.

In Vanity Fair, Richard Lawson wrote about how it seems like a "strange and cruel right of passage for an actress, to play a scene where she's begging for her life in her underwear" and I think that might be what your girlfriend is noticing. I cringed when I first saw that the black girl was walking wearing spiked heel boots and a super-revealing skirt (seriously, who would wear that to a birthday party where someone's dad was?), and cringed again when the girl was forced to take off her sweater. It seems the default way to shame women, especially young women, in film is to make them partially undressed, especially as "punishment" for some perceived crime.

this article also seems to tune in to what your girlfriend noticed:
http://www.vulture.com/2017/01/movie-review-split-m-night-shyamalan.html

Respecfully, I don't know you or your girlfriend, but she seems very uncomfortable with the girls in the movie and seemed to try and project that discomfort on you. She was trying to manipulate you into not being turned on by them. Guys sometimes do that by implying that the sexy actor is probably gay. Lol

If she wasn't bothered, embarrassed, or felt insecure about it, that subject wouldn't have come to mind. I would think that she'd be more disturbed about the uncle scene.

She also seems the type that doesn't know how to just shut up and watch the damn movie.

Your girlfriend is either overly political or irrational in some other way.

The way you're describing makes it sounds like she's being a hyperbolic and militant, which may be accuratebut she's not wrong. Making children "attractive" in an adult sense is not a new thing. Look at Toddlers in Tiaras (especially when they give them padded bras), Brittney Spears in Hit Me Baby One More Time, Jon Benet Ramsey, Natalie Portman in The Professional, Lolita etcetera. And lets not forget Jodie Foster in Taxi Driver as a young prostitute

I don't know about the idea that they're trying to "relax" us to the idea of pedophilia though. The only scene that I felt really did that was when little Casey unzips her own jacket in the woodsbut it also shows how much of a control game sexual abuse is. I don't think it was meant to tantalize anyone. And if someone was turned on by that, they should probably talk to a therapist.

As far as showing a fair amount of the girls' skinI wouldn't say it wasn't necessary in the context of this movie. The theme was vulnerability and control, which is what was conveyed by him taking their clothes away. There wasn't really anything else for him to take away anyway. For Dennis it was about gaining control (notice he didn't take the clothes forcefully, he made them give their clothes to him) and for the girls it was about losing control. Dennis only existed because Kevin had lost control in the ultimate way. It was the first step in making them "suffer" to purify their hearts. Also, it wasn't that scandalous, we didn't see any more than you could see at a beach. I'm not concerned with someone being attracted to the girls (especially because the actors might legally be adults), but more concerned if the attraction is because of their status as victims and their perceived age (by that I mean that I don't condemn dom/sub relationships between consenting adultswhich is a whole different thing).

The scene where Hedwig kisses Casey was mostly suspect because we (as the audience) didn't know what to make of that situationwas it really Hedwig or Dennis pretending to be Hedwig like he pretended to be Barry? Was he trying to disarm her somehow, like her uncle disarmed her with the wild animal game (although I don't think we knew that part yet)? As far as Casey was concerned, she was trying to gain Hedwig's trust and not bring out Dennis. I think she was very creeped out, but saw an opportunity and knew that rejecting Hedwig might have made things worse for her. It would have been weirder if she or Hedwig had tried to take it further, because then we'd have an adult male with an underage female (physiologically) and simultaneously an older teenage girl with a child (mentally). But I think him initiating the "kiss", which consisted of pressing his lips on the side of her lips and her not reciprocating at all, wasn't really in the realm of pedophilia. It was just weird.

All that being said, this is an interpretation-intensive movie. If your girlfriend took away something very different than you, that doesn't mean either of you is wrongbut it also doesn't mean you're a pedophile if you feel anything but hate for the film.

Sandifay, I like the points you make about her. She was trying futilely to make me not feel attracted to the girls or to feel guilty about it if I was. I didn't appreciate that and I told her about it but of course she denied it. I'm not surprised. We spoke again today and she got pissy, telling me that she'll dye her hair again if I keep annoying her. And forget about seeing Split again because she's made it clear it disturbed her and its a bit interesting how she never commented on the "real" perceived pedophilia in the movie.

Sounds like a nut job. you can do better .. dump her
God Damn! We just had a near-life experience, fellas.