Lights Out : So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Number one, you can calm down. Number two, so you're saying it was a "literal entity"? Because I was talking to people who thought it was just depression and not an actual "ghost". That's how I took what they were saying anyway.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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It's both. The story functions on two levels. On one level it's a ghost story with an actual ghost that manifests and terrorizes the characters, on another level the story serves as a metaphor for the destructive nature of depression. It's not that the ghost is depression, it simply serves as a symbol for depression. The text is the ghost story, the subtext is the statement the film is making about a more abstract concept. This kind of thing is very common in horror films. Michael Meyers from Halloween, for example, is at once a physical being and a character in the film, but metaphorically he stands in for a more abstract concept - evil. Or, for a more popular example, look at something like The Dark Knight. The Joker is the Joker, but he's also a stand for and a personification of the very concept of chaos and/or anarchy.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Another possible theory is, the little girl she supposively befriended never existed in the first place.
Then how do you explain the files that the father uncovered including pictures and an audiotape and records of Dianna's death?
I would say my memory is not what it used to be. But I don't remember what my memory used to be.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Maybe it's not meant metaphorically?
Maybe, in fact, she wasn't depressed at all? Maybe she was actually being haunted by an actual monster and the lack of people believing her led to all sorts of misdiagnoses, like depression, to say nothing of actual depression (not the clinical kind, but the kind with a really good reason that can only be resolved by handling the reason)?
Maybe it's just a literal monster movie with a literal monster that does a bad thing to a good person, expressly attracted to the kindness that person possesses?
I did think of your interpretation while I was watching the movie, and I felt that the movie tried really hard to steer me away from that metaphor, by being so very literal at every step. For example, the stepfather was murdered, literally, and remotely from the mother, and apparently because he's trying to help her. So much turns up to validate her (literal) fears and grief at every step. Also her final act was one of literal heroism, whereas suicide is not (and can't be, outside of very peculiar contexts like this one).
But even if it were a metaphor, why take it as prescription? Maybe it's meant descriptively, i.e., "this is how depressed people behave"? Why take it as "this is how depressed people behave, and you should, too?" Maybe it's meant to say "Handle the monsters before things get desperate"?
I mean, if it is a metaphor, it's almost certainly in there because someone making the film has personal experience, too, either experiencing depression firsthand or losing (or nearly losing) someone to depression.
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http://moviegique.com/
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Maybe, in fact, she wasn't depressed at all? Maybe she was actually being haunted by an actual monster and the lack of people believing her led to all sorts of misdiagnoses, like depression, to say nothing of actual depression (not the clinical kind, but the kind with a really good reason that can only be resolved by handling the reason)?
Maybe it's just a literal monster movie with a literal monster that does a bad thing to a good person, expressly attracted to the kindness that person possesses?
I did think of your interpretation while I was watching the movie, and I felt that the movie tried really hard to steer me away from that metaphor, by being so very literal at every step. For example, the stepfather was murdered, literally, and remotely from the mother, and apparently because he's trying to help her. So much turns up to validate her (literal) fears and grief at every step. Also her final act was one of literal heroism, whereas suicide is not (and can't be, outside of very peculiar contexts like this one).
But even if it were a metaphor, why take it as prescription? Maybe it's meant descriptively, i.e., "this is how depressed people behave"? Why take it as "this is how depressed people behave, and you should, too?" Maybe it's meant to say "Handle the monsters before things get desperate"?
I mean, if it is a metaphor, it's almost certainly in there because someone making the film has personal experience, too, either experiencing depression firsthand or losing (or nearly losing) someone to depression.
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http://moviegique.com/
I go to the movies more than you.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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They never mention depression in the movie
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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what movie did you watch? It was mentioned many times and was the cause of Sophie going to the mental hospital in the first place. And you are accusing others of taking it too literally (and to some extent I agree) but you are taking it too metaphorically. The depression made her weak and thus vulnerable to Dianna. Dianna was a manifestation of her illness once she died but was obviously very real and powerful responsible for several murders. And yes, depression (or substitute some other illnesswhatever made her weak and susceptible) made suicide the best solution in that case at that time to save her children. This movie was indeed very much about depression. But the last thing Sandberg is trying to say is that suicide is generally the best solution to depression.
I would say my memory is not what it used to be. But I don't remember what my memory used to be.
I would say my memory is not what it used to be. But I don't remember what my memory used to be.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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This???? After all your proselytizing, and your patronizing attitude towards those who don't share your point of view, you post that comment???
Makes me think you didn't watch the film at all.
Ignorance is bliss 'til it posts on the Internet, then, it's annoying.
Makes me think you didn't watch the film at all.
Ignorance is bliss 'til it posts on the Internet, then, it's annoying.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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the stepfather was murdered, literally, and remotely from the mother, and apparently because he's trying to help her.
So?
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Well, I'm willing to hear counter-arguments but it seems to me that depression shouldn't be moving remotely from its source, against someone who's identified it and taking positive action against it.
If, for example, the guy had been going the other waywallowing in self-pity, maybe drugging or whoringand then it got him, I'd see a stronger connection.
What do you think?
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http://moviegique.com/
I go to the movies more than you.
If, for example, the guy had been going the other waywallowing in self-pity, maybe drugging or whoringand then it got him, I'd see a stronger connection.
What do you think?
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http://moviegique.com/
I go to the movies more than you.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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I thought it was meant to represent how mental illness can alienate sufferers from their loved ones and also how a person's best efforts to help someone with depression might be futile. He was trying to help her but the thing she was fighting was too strong and it wound up destroying their relationship (by murdering the husband). Also the proximity doesn't really bother me because the on the surface it is still just a ghost story and the ghost can apparently travel at least some distance from its host.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Yeah, I guess it comes down to where (or when) you draw the line. Analogies are imperfect by nature. You can always say, "Well, at this point, it's literal, and at this point, it's metaphorical."
The thing I find highly improbable is that it was made with the intent of prescribing suicide for the depressed, per the OP. For me, the literalness is important at that point.
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http://moviegique.com/
I go to the movies more than you.
The thing I find highly improbable is that it was made with the intent of prescribing suicide for the depressed, per the OP. For me, the literalness is important at that point.
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http://moviegique.com/
I go to the movies more than you.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Yes, I don't think that was the filmmakers intention at all but that was still the impression I came away with.
I mean, suicide is portrayed as being the solution to the problem. While you can look at the ending as a tragedy or a warning that depression can often end in suicide, that suicide is a way out that people suffering with depression choose far too often, that doesn't change the fact that the resolution - the thing that stops the bad guy - is suicide and that it's portrayed as a heroic act. Even though there are some flickering lights at the end that indicate that maybe the suicide didn't solve anything after all, that's the end of the movie and it's not explored any further.
But I don't blame the filmmakers for this because the movie ends the way it does in its current version due to test audiences and studio interference. Basically the entire movie is an allegory for depression, but the ending they had planned that fit with that allegory tested poorly and they had to change it to an ending that was actually contrary to the themes the rest of the movie seemed to be driven by. The original ending sounds much more apt and much less problematic.
I mean, suicide is portrayed as being the solution to the problem. While you can look at the ending as a tragedy or a warning that depression can often end in suicide, that suicide is a way out that people suffering with depression choose far too often, that doesn't change the fact that the resolution - the thing that stops the bad guy - is suicide and that it's portrayed as a heroic act. Even though there are some flickering lights at the end that indicate that maybe the suicide didn't solve anything after all, that's the end of the movie and it's not explored any further.
But I don't blame the filmmakers for this because the movie ends the way it does in its current version due to test audiences and studio interference. Basically the entire movie is an allegory for depression, but the ending they had planned that fit with that allegory tested poorly and they had to change it to an ending that was actually contrary to the themes the rest of the movie seemed to be driven by. The original ending sounds much more apt and much less problematic.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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You've probably read this, it sounds like, or something similar:
http://www.avclub.com/article/lights-out-director-david-sandberg-defends-ending240341
Sounds like the "kill yourself" ending emerged from studios changing the metaphor to a literal reality, and then audiences taking it literally and not liking the more correct-for-the-metaphor (i.e., suicide isn't the answer) ending, and that ending being removed.
So suicide isn't being advocated but you can certainly see how this arose.
And thus, an Internet argument was happily resolved with no one being murdered.
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http://moviegique.com/
I go to the movies more than you.
http://www.avclub.com/article/lights-out-director-david-sandberg-defends-ending240341
Sounds like the "kill yourself" ending emerged from studios changing the metaphor to a literal reality, and then audiences taking it literally and not liking the more correct-for-the-metaphor (i.e., suicide isn't the answer) ending, and that ending being removed.
So suicide isn't being advocated but you can certainly see how this arose.
And thus, an Internet argument was happily resolved with no one being murdered.
-
http://moviegique.com/
I go to the movies more than you.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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And thus, an Internet argument was happily resolved with no one being murdered.
Yeah feels cool.
http://batopusvs.com/
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Don't worry about it. It's just a horror movie. There's no message. I've been struggling with depression for about 15 years now and I don't really give a *beep* about such things anymore. Have a nice day.
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Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Mental health is not a thing? Are you serious ?
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Depression doesn't really answer why the people in the movie actually end up hurt or killed by her. I think a better explanation would be that she has schizophrenia and Diana is her "other half." That would still explain the comment of her being better on her meds and also why she is talking to herself in the closet, but also why these people are being harmed in the process and why killing herself stopped it.
Or you could just take it at face value as a horror Movie.
To each their own.
Or you could just take it at face value as a horror Movie.
To each their own.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Yes you're right. Schizophrenia could be one of her issue. It's not incompatible with depression though. They both often work together.
But, you do harm people when being depressed. I know that for sure. You reject people's help, sometimes by hurting them to make sure they don't try to help again.
A depressed person can be very mean and cruel, it's a defense mechanism. That's why it's really hard to help them
But, you do harm people when being depressed. I know that for sure. You reject people's help, sometimes by hurting them to make sure they don't try to help again.
A depressed person can be very mean and cruel, it's a defense mechanism. That's why it's really hard to help them
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Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Congratulations on proving that human stupidity has no limits. Good grief.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Did you watch the movie? She killed herself to save her kids. Diana was linked to her life, and that was the fastest way to stop her. They didn't have time to get more of her medicine. Her daughter's life was in danger.
I am clincally depressed and have been for over half my life, but I could understand why the mom did what she did. And nor did I take it as any kind of message for "go kill yourself if you're depressed."
I am clincally depressed and have been for over half my life, but I could understand why the mom did what she did. And nor did I take it as any kind of message for "go kill yourself if you're depressed."
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I understand why she did it, i just thought it's a clumsy message for depressed people, wether it was on purpose or not
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Considering it's a horror movie, isn't it fitting to say that suicide is an effective way to end depression?
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Mmmmmthat's an interesting point of view.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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I totally agree with your interpretation that Diane is metaphor for depression or other mental conditions. The very fact that Diane only "lives in the dark" and that she tries to hurt or kill the loved ones of Sophie points in that direction. Then again, we don't necessarily have to interpret Sophie's suicide at the end as the "moral of the story"; in fact if she had just waited a few more minutes the whole family would have been saved by the cops, she could have continued with the meds and everything would have turned out fine! :-)
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Yes, my interpretation was provocative on purpose (to get people talking and it worked!).
I don't actually think this movie meant to have a moral. But it just bothered me that the depressed person was the one ending up dead
I don't actually think this movie meant to have a moral. But it just bothered me that the depressed person was the one ending up dead
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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True, it was a sad ending. Especially since she was getting closer to her family and a hopefully better life.
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I agree.
Diana was obviously linked to her depression.
Killing herself to be rid of Diana / depression was a really irresponsible message by the filmmakers.
Due to the lack of moderators, trolls can ruin the IMDB message boards. Don't feed them.
Diana was obviously linked to her depression.
Killing herself to be rid of Diana / depression was a really irresponsible message by the filmmakers.
Due to the lack of moderators, trolls can ruin the IMDB message boards. Don't feed them.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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No. Diana is NOT depression. Diana was a demon that MADE her host depressed. And the only thing that is able to kill this demon is to kill yourself.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Actually Diana feeds on depression, she only appears when the mom is at her worst.
So one way to stop her would have been to fight and get better but she didn't have that kind of time at the end and she did take the quick way out.
Lights Out was a monster movie, the fact they explained how Diana came to exist in this form is a proof she is REAL.
Instead of enjoying this movie you did like everyone in 2016, you find a part to whine about and say how horrible these filmmakers are. If it wasn't about this it would have been about racism, sexism.
So one way to stop her would have been to fight and get better but she didn't have that kind of time at the end and she did take the quick way out.
Lights Out was a monster movie, the fact they explained how Diana came to exist in this form is a proof she is REAL.
Instead of enjoying this movie you did like everyone in 2016, you find a part to whine about and say how horrible these filmmakers are. If it wasn't about this it would have been about racism, sexism.
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Diana isn't depression.
Diana was an actual person who they suggest had some kind of psychic power to get into peoples' minds. She was killed by accident in treatment. Somehow her spirit/ghost has a seed in Sophie's head and is able to materialize out of Sophie's energy. Sophie's meds suppressed her ability to allow Diana to materialize. I've seen other movies where people have powers to see or create things that are suppressed by medicine.
I suppose you could argue that it is metaphorical, but I think that is looking too deeply since everyone else can see Diane also.
Diana was an actual person who they suggest had some kind of psychic power to get into peoples' minds. She was killed by accident in treatment. Somehow her spirit/ghost has a seed in Sophie's head and is able to materialize out of Sophie's energy. Sophie's meds suppressed her ability to allow Diana to materialize. I've seen other movies where people have powers to see or create things that are suppressed by medicine.
I suppose you could argue that it is metaphorical, but I think that is looking too deeply since everyone else can see Diane also.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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No, but if you are posessed by a killer demon that only kills others if you are alive, then yeah, you probably should.
The spirit of abysmal despair
The spirit of abysmal despair
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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So if everything in this movie is a metaphor to you why are you looking at the bullet to the head as literal? Maybe that is just her taking her meds.
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IF that's the metaphor we are going with I'm afraid it's deeper than that. If Diana represeted depression than it wasn't simply "I'm depressed I have to kill myself." That depression was the direct cause of harm to her family. As a metaphor we will say she killed no one, Diana is just depression lets not be drastic and say in her depressed state of mind she killed her previous husbands. However this is what the metaphor would break down to.
Due to her depression she herself changed into this horrific type of person, and was the cause of her previous relationships failing(Diana killing her husbands in the movie). In addition the scene where she is watching a movie with her son and introduces Diana quickly becomes child abuse if Diana is simply depression. He constantly tells her to stop doing what she is doing, he is afraid and concerned. IN this ways he does NOT stop and she continues to harm her child mentally. Since the monster is a metaphor it is likely verbal abuse in the real spectrum of things.
She single handedly destroys her family even though they were trying to help her. Her current husband before his demise(divorce as metaphors go) was looking into her case(illness) and trying to find a way to help his wife. He was pushed away (killed in the movie) by this depressive side of her.
In this particular film if we use the metaphor of Diana as depression then the mother literally became this horrible monster of a person and saw no way to help her family than to remove herself from the picture as she was very literally the cause of ALL of her family's issues. Every time they tried to help her she turned against them (Since Diana is just a metaphor and not actually doing anything) the mother herself was actually lashing out at the family.
So no it wasn't Depress=kill yourself.
In her specific case it was depression turning her into a twisted person that only harmed the ones she loved. Upon realizing this she saw no other recourse but to take her own life to try and give what was left of her family a better one.
Not as cut and dry as you seemed to take it. Regardless no one should kill themselves in a real life situation.
I've baited my hook with my own underwear. Is it wrong that I hope to catch a fish I can relate to?-Ragdoll.
Due to her depression she herself changed into this horrific type of person, and was the cause of her previous relationships failing(Diana killing her husbands in the movie). In addition the scene where she is watching a movie with her son and introduces Diana quickly becomes child abuse if Diana is simply depression. He constantly tells her to stop doing what she is doing, he is afraid and concerned. IN this ways he does NOT stop and she continues to harm her child mentally. Since the monster is a metaphor it is likely verbal abuse in the real spectrum of things.
She single handedly destroys her family even though they were trying to help her. Her current husband before his demise(divorce as metaphors go) was looking into her case(illness) and trying to find a way to help his wife. He was pushed away (killed in the movie) by this depressive side of her.
In this particular film if we use the metaphor of Diana as depression then the mother literally became this horrible monster of a person and saw no way to help her family than to remove herself from the picture as she was very literally the cause of ALL of her family's issues. Every time they tried to help her she turned against them (Since Diana is just a metaphor and not actually doing anything) the mother herself was actually lashing out at the family.
So no it wasn't Depress=kill yourself.
In her specific case it was depression turning her into a twisted person that only harmed the ones she loved. Upon realizing this she saw no other recourse but to take her own life to try and give what was left of her family a better one.
Not as cut and dry as you seemed to take it. Regardless no one should kill themselves in a real life situation.
I've baited my hook with my own underwear. Is it wrong that I hope to catch a fish I can relate to?-Ragdoll.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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If she had the time to get better Diana would eventually go away, but she didn't have the time, Diana was going to kill her children, she had to kill herself to save them.
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I'm not sure a lot of you understand what a metaphor is. The OP's take on it seems perfectly plausible to me. But if you just want to see it as a monster movie then guess what? That's OK too.
"Look at banner Michael!"
"Look at banner Michael!"
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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If you are going to make life changing decisions based on a movie then OP you should really kill yourself.
nobody lives forever
nobody lives forever
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Hi! I don't think the film is meant to be interpreted quite so allegorically as this - after all, the fact that the film captures multiple perspectives (not just Sophie's) indicates that the supernatural events are really - well - supernatural in nature. I don't think that Sophie's depression killed the cop, for example, or lifted Brett off of the ground near the garage - or affected Rebecca and Martin in Rebecca's own apartment.
HOWEVER, if you do interpret it allegorically, I don't think that the tragic ending is a PRESCRIPTION. It's not, "If you have depression, then you might as well kill yourself." In any tragedy, the end is not necessarily what the author thinks "should" happen in real life. Often it is the worst possible combination of circumstances. Therefore, a person taking their life IS a realistic POSSIBLE end result for a spiraling bout of depression. Not the only possibility, but one of them.
I also agree with someone who posted earlier on the allegory, saying that Diana/depression twisted Sophie into a harmful version of herself that pushed away/alienated all those who loved/could help her. If one is unable to stop it, depression can warp and destroy everything of value in one's life. Therefore, from Sophie's perspective, once she is on the point of losing everything that she holds dear as a result of her rampant depression, it makes sense that she would come to the (tragic) conclusion that life is not worth living anymore.
HOWEVER, if you do interpret it allegorically, I don't think that the tragic ending is a PRESCRIPTION. It's not, "If you have depression, then you might as well kill yourself." In any tragedy, the end is not necessarily what the author thinks "should" happen in real life. Often it is the worst possible combination of circumstances. Therefore, a person taking their life IS a realistic POSSIBLE end result for a spiraling bout of depression. Not the only possibility, but one of them.
I also agree with someone who posted earlier on the allegory, saying that Diana/depression twisted Sophie into a harmful version of herself that pushed away/alienated all those who loved/could help her. If one is unable to stop it, depression can warp and destroy everything of value in one's life. Therefore, from Sophie's perspective, once she is on the point of losing everything that she holds dear as a result of her rampant depression, it makes sense that she would come to the (tragic) conclusion that life is not worth living anymore.
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself
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Ever heard of the words SPOILER ALERT?? Do the world a favour and get your whole head in front of the shotgun before pulling the trigger and painting your last self portrait you dumb khunt.
I hope you do.
but battling with depression myself, i hope i won't get to this point!
I hope you do.
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Yeah, that's what I took from it, too. It's unfortunate this ending is a product of negative reactions in test screenings. The original ending sounds much more appropriate and far less problematic. This turned out to be one of my biggest problems with the movie and and totally undermined the themes.
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Funny, I didn't take it that way at all I took it as she had a problem she didn't know how to solve, and she feared it would kill her family. In a situation like that, and you feel it's all your fault and you're powerless, it makes sense.
Obviously this is a movie, not reality, but I think it is a good allegory of how people with depression often think, why? Because I struggled with it for over a decade, I would know. It doesn't have to end in death, it's never totally hopeless, but it sure feels like it a lot when you're depressed.
God Bless ~Amy
Obviously this is a movie, not reality, but I think it is a good allegory of how people with depression often think, why? Because I struggled with it for over a decade, I would know. It doesn't have to end in death, it's never totally hopeless, but it sure feels like it a lot when you're depressed.
God Bless ~Amy
Re: So if you're depressed you should kill yourself