Politics : I hope this is the last time the US elect a bunch of amateurs

It usually takes years for an administration to collapse so spectacularly.

Sorry folks, but your experiment with an 'anti-establishment outsider' has failed. We now need to do damage limitation and get rid of Trump.

Last Seen Films: Silence - 10/10, La La Land - 10/10, Hacksaw Ridge - 8/10

What failed?

He won't be able to provide any real examples.

He's a pathetic crybaby who represents everything wrong with the establishment left that he claims to be against.

I hope Harvey chokes on his schizophrenia medication.

"I'm not a leftist, but liberal"
-pilarinhavana clarifying her political position

The debacle over the National Security Adviser is a pretty spectacular failure bearing in mind that this administration isn't even a month old.

Last Seen Films: Silence - 10/10, La La Land - 10/10, Hacksaw Ridge - 8/10

It was much ado about nothing. So the incoming national security adviser talked to the Russian ambassador about the sanctions possibly beine lifted.

This is the kind of thing that nobody would have blinked at under Obama.

Ex IMDb users forum here: http://area51.boardhost.com/index.php

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logan_Act

"Worthington, we're being attacked by giant bats!"

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This is the kind of thing that nobody would have blinked at under Obama.

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Hahahah - Fox "News" would have been all over it 24/7, and you damn well know it.

Regardless, you might have a valid point. It could be relatively innocuous, but aren't there recordings/transcripts of his conversations? If so, why is there "speculation" about what they discussed?


So it goes.

The entire administration is in disarray.

The failed EO.

The security debacle at Mar-a-Lago.

Flynn.

His imbecilic tweeting and railing at the "fake" media for reporting, you know, the facts.

His meltdown with the Australian PM.

etc



Not that any of this will mean anything to his mindless and slavish drones.









Dalai Llama Lama Puss Puss
Stella Marls Missa Nobis

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The failed EO.

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There's only a temporary ban, hence preliminary injunction.

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The security debacle at Mar-a-Lago.

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Non-sequitur if you declared that Hillary's private server to be a non-issue.

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Flynn.

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Obama hired him as the Director of the DIA and then forced him into Retirement when he questioned the safety of America against Al Qaeda.

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His imbecilic tweeting and railing at the "fake" media for reporting, you know, the facts.

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The media has NOT been reporting facts tho, they reported a Hillary win for months with all of their poll data.

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His meltdown with the Australian PM.

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This might be your only valid claim. Then again, it is Australia.

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There's only a temporary ban, hence preliminary injunction.

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The injunction is only possible because the actual EO was constructed by incompetents.

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Non-sequitur if you declared that Hillary's private server to be a non-issue.

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Erm, that's not what a "non sequitur" is.

But the irony of bringing up Hillary as a defence is an amusing defence.

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Obama hired him as the Director of the DIA and then forced him into Retirement when he questioned the safety of America against Al Qaeda.

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Which has what to do with the entire fiasco surrounding him at present. See if you can respond without mentioning a democrat.

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The media has NOT been reporting facts tho, they reported a Hillary win for months with all of their poll data.

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Another American who can't discriminate between "lying" and being "wrong". Check it out.












Dalai Llama Lama Puss Puss
Stella Marls Missa Nobis

Get used to it, dude. Eight years of guaranteed fun, then there's no telling what the US will follow it up with. Maybe Kanye.

Nothing fvcking happened this is just like the campaign when every other day hysterical plebs said his campaign was done, before he clobbered the media anointed winner in a landslide.

No.

You shut your damn mouth.

You think electing 'trained professionals' gets the job done where politics is concerned?

Trained professionals have us now $20 TRILLION in DEBT NOT amateurs.

YOU SHUT YOUR GOD DAMNED MOUTH.

SIT THE F!CK DOWN.

ENJOY THE RIDE.

You Should Have Voted Sanders But Have A Hug Anyway.

The ignorant fat immigrant tv repairman has spoken for his people.

Blehhhhh.








Dalai Llama Lama Puss Puss
Stella Marls Missa Nobis

Suck it Theodore.

If you would use your brain for just one second he's discounting any other attempts at changing the system from 'amateurs'.

You know what?

The whole God damn French Revolution was full of amateurs.

The whole God damn American Revolution was full of amateurs.

The fathers of many modern scientific discoveries started as God blessed amateurs.

So when I tell you to f!ck off with a waffle maker i mean:

F!CK OFF WITH A PLUGGED IN WAFFLE MAKER YOU GOD DAMN USELESS MORON!

At least sh!t can be put to good use unlike your face.

You Should Have Voted Sanders But Have A Hug Anyway.

"The whole God damn French Revolution was full of amateurs."

No, they weren't. They were serving members of the Third Estate, the French Parliament.

"The whole God damn American Revolution was full of amateurs."

Who had served in local government, state government, English military and local militias.

"The fathers of many modern scientific discoveries started as God blessed amateurs."

When was the last time an amateur made major waves in science?

Its happening rarer and rarer. When it does, its an obscure field.

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

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Alexander Herzen, like Diderot, was an amateur of genius whose opinions and activities changed the direction of social thought in his country. Like Diderot too, he was a brilliant and irrepressible talker. He talked equally well in Russian and French to his intimate friends and in the Moscow salons, and later in his life in Russian, German, French, in Paris, Nice, London, Genevaalways in an overwhelming flow of ideas and images; the loss to posterity (as with Diderot) is probably immense; he had no Boswell, no Eckermann, to record his conversation, nor would he have suffered such a relationship. His prose is essentially a form of talk, with the vices and virtues of talk: eloquent, spontaneous, liable to the heightened tones and exaggerations of the born storyteller unable to resist long digressions which themselves carry him into a network of intersecting tributaries of memory or speculation, but always returning to the main stream of the story or the argument. Above all, his prose has the vitality of spoken wordsit appears to owe nothing to the carefully composed formal sentences of the French philosophes whom he admired or to the terrible philosophical style of the Germans from whom he learned. We hear his voicealmost too muchin the essays, the pamphlets, the autobiography, as much as in the letters and scraps of notes to his friends.

Civilized, imaginative, self-critical, Herzen was a marvelously gifted social observer; the record of what he saw is unique, even in the articulate nineteenth century. He had an acute, easily stirred, and ironical mind, a fiery and poetical temperament, and a capacity for vivid, often lyrical, writingqualities that combined and reinforced one another in the succession of sharp vignettes of men, events, ideas, personal relationships, political situations, and descriptions of entire forms of life in which his writings abound. He was a man of extreme refinement and sensibility, great intellectual energy and biting wit, easily irritated amour propre, and a taste for polemical writing; he was addicted to analysis, investigation, exposure; he saw himself as an expert unmasker of appearances and conventions, and dramatized himself as a devastating discoverer of their social and moral core. Tolstoy, who had little sympathy with Herzens opinions, and was not given to excessive praise of his contemporaries among men of letters, especially among his countrymen, said toward the end of his life that he had never met anyone with so rare a combination of scintillating brilliance and depth. These gifts make a good many of Herzens essays, political articles, day-to-day journalism, causal notes and reviews, and especially letters written to intimates or to political correspondents, irresistibly readable even today, when the issues with which they were concerned are for the most part dead and of interest mainly to historians.

Although much has been written about Herzen, and not only in Russian, the task of his biographers has not been made easier by the fact that he left an incomparable memorial to himself in his own greatest worktranslated by Constance Garnett as My Past and Thoughtsa literary masterpiece worthy of being placed by the side of the novels of his contemporaries and countrymen, Tolstoy, Turgenev, Dostoevsky. Nor were they altogether unaware of this. Turgenev, an intimate and life-long friend (the fluctuations of their personal relationship were important in the lives of both; this complex and interesting story has never been adequately told) admired him both as a writer and as a revolutionary journalist. The celebrated critic Vissarion Belinsky discovered, described, and acclaimed his extraordinary literary gift when they were both young and relatively unknown. Even the angry and suspicious Dostoevsky excepted him from the virulent hatred with which he regarded pro-Western Russian revolutionaries, recognized the poetry of his writing, and remained well-disposed toward him until the end of his life. As for Tolstoy, he delighted both in his society and his writings: half a century after their first meeting in London he still remembered the scene vividly.1

It is strange that this remarkable writer, in his lifetime a celebrated European figure, the admired friend of Michelet, Mazzini, Garibaldi, and Victor Hugo, long canonized in his own country not only as a revolutionary but as one of its greatest men of letters, is, even today, not much more than a name in the West. The enjoyment to be obtained from reading his prosefor the most part still untranslatedmakes this a strange and gratuitous loss.

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For a simple example.

You Should Have Voted Sanders But Have A Hug Anyway.

Had nothing to do with either the French or American revolutions.

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

I never said she did.

I said there were noobs in those Revolutions who shed their blood for what they believed in.

You Should Have Voted Sanders But Have A Hug Anyway.

"I never said she did.

I said there were noobs in those Revolutions who shed their blood for what they believed in."

No, you didn't. You wrote:

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The whole God damn French Revolution was full of amateurs.

The whole God damn American Revolution was full of amateurs.

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And you wrote that in response to the question of whether or not amateur leadership was a good thing.

Don't change your argument, Bear.

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

both revolutions WERE full of amateurs!

amateur troops.

amateur orators.

amateur revolutionary thinkers.

you think the revolutions ran on old school blood alone?

ha!

I Am Going To Life Tap, Heal Me!

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The whole God damn French Revolution was full of amateurs.

The whole God damn American Revolution was full of amateurs.

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I stand by this 100%!

Most of the idealistic youngsters who stood their ground and died defending their causes were not motivated by money or power.

I Am Going To Life Tap, Heal Me!

Topic is still about leadership.

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

I never said one word about leadership.

I defended amateurs.

I am an amateur of sorts.

No formal education at all in computers not even an A+ Certification.

I would daresay I'm 95% better in overall customer satisfaction than any 'trained professional' at The Geek Squad.

I Am Going To Life Tap, Heal Me!

"I never said one word about leadership."

You didn't need to, the thread title is:

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I hope this is the last time the US elect a bunch of amateurs

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"I am an amateur of sorts.

No formal education at all in computers not even an A+ Certification.

I would daresay I'm 95% better in overall customer satisfaction than any 'trained professional' at The Geek Squad."

And my respect to you, but that isn't government, and sure as hell isn't being president of this country.

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

Technically then it is wrong as we did not elect A BUNCH OF AMATEURS.

We elected one where the OP's issues are concerned.

I Am Going To Life Tap, Heal Me!

The confirmation process could be considered a form of election.

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

then the US didn't elect them directly or via EC.

I Am Going To Life Tap, Heal Me!

Still close enough for the title not to be generally correct.

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

Nope.

You're not an American, are you?

Because what you are saying makes no sense. My taxes pay for the local librarian. If she decides to take some 16 year old and make hot sex in the library and gets caught - did i then elect her because I paid her salary? Or elected her since I elected the town manager who then decided to hire said librarian?



I Am Going To Life Tap, Heal Me!

"You're not an American, are you?"

Only as American as you are Asian.

"Because what you are saying makes no sense. My taxes pay for the local librarian. If she decides to take some 16 year old and make hot sex in the library and gets caught - did i then elect her because I paid her salary? Or elected her since I elected the town manager who then decided to hire said librarian?"

Librarians are not an elected position, senators are.

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

aren't we discussing cabinet positions? those are not.

and i only elect my senators - if i cared to vote for them.

i do not elect the one in say, New Jersey.

I Am Going To Life Tap, Heal Me!

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Joan of Arc (French: Jeanne d'Arc,[5] IPA: [an daʁk]; 6 January c. 1412[6] 30 May 1431), nicknamed "The Maid of Orléans" (French: La Pucelle d'Orléans), is considered a heroine of France for her role during the Lancastrian phase of the Hundred Years' War, and was canonized as a Roman Catholic saint. Joan of Arc was born to Jacques d'Arc and Isabelle Romée, a peasant family, at Domrémy in north-east France. Joan said she received visions of the Archangel Michael, Saint Margaret, and Saint Catherine of Alexandria instructing her to support Charles VII and recover France from English domination late in the Hundred Years' War. The uncrowned King Charles VII sent Joan to the siege of Orléans as part of a relief mission. She gained prominence after the siege was lifted only nine days later. Several additional swift victories led to Charles VII's coronation at Reims. This long-awaited event boosted French morale and paved the way for the final French victory.

On 23 May 1430, she was captured at Compiègne by the Burgundian faction, which was allied with the English. She was later handed over to the English[7] and put on trial by the pro-English Bishop of Beauvais Pierre Cauchon on a variety of charges.[8] After Cauchon declared her guilty she was burned at the stake on 30 May 1431, dying at about nineteen years of age.[9]

In 1456, an inquisitorial court authorized by Pope Callixtus III examined the trial, debunked the charges against her, pronounced her innocent, and declared her a martyr.[9] In the 16th century she became a symbol of the Catholic League, and in 1803 she was declared a national symbol of France by the decision of Napoleon Bonaparte.[10] She was beatified in 1909 and canonized in 1920. Joan of Arc is one of the nine secondary patron saints of France, along with St. Denis, St. Martin of Tours, St. Louis, St. Michael, St. Rémi, St. Petronilla, St. Radegund and Ste. Thérèse of Lisieux.

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Another example.

You Should Have Voted Sanders But Have A Hug Anyway.

Joan of Arc was the 1400s, not 1700s.

Plus, she might really have been divinely inspired given the multiple fields she excelled in. I don't believe God chooses a side in war, but both sides were ultimately better off. Getting kicked out France, finally made the English Kings focus on thier own country. A uinited France was a strong France.

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

Who cares when it was?

Or how she was inspired? By God?

Some tell us there is no God. :)

Maybe you need to reread this whole thread because either I've lost you or you've lost me.



You Should Have Voted Sanders But Have A Hug Anyway.

"Who cares when it was?"

You. Since you made the argument that amateurs won both the French and American Revolution.

If you can't find evidence to sustain that point, then just admit you were wrong.

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

Poor kid.

Take it easy on him.












Dalai Llama Lama Puss Puss
Stella Marls Missa Nobis

Poor kid my ass.

Do you know how and why I am respected by many of our peers?

Because I don't just say random sh!t and run, like you.

I am a bit crazy and I am a bit intelligent all at once. I have no qualms taking an hour or two or 10 to find support for my claims. This is how I made a friend of Gaebe who prior did not like me too much. I earned his respect in a 6 hour heated discussion on the American banking industry.

That was a fun day and we had some good conversations afterwards until Diablo went full retard.

Stupid Diablo.

You Should Have Voted Sanders But Have A Hug Anyway.

Are you daft?

American troops were not the professional troops the red coats were. These were mostly farmers and kids barely in their teens:

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What sort of soldier stood in the Continental Army? Historians have pieced together a composite portrait, using, among other evidence, muster rolls, and veterans' pension applications posted in the 1820s and 1830s.

Like many soldiers in America's conflicts, the common Continental was, on average, quite young. One historian found that in nine New Jersey towns nearly 75 percent of boys who were fifteen and sixteen at the onset of hostilities served in the army or the militia. Martin was fifteen when he enlisted, artilleryman Jeremiah Levering entered the service at twelve or thirteen, and hundreds more under the legal age of sixteen served in all services. Thousands more were under twenty.

Most of those pickings also were poor and drawn "from the disrespected and dispossessed ranks of society," according to historian Holly A. Mayer, and they "had little or no property or marketable skill." Pay was poor and often delayed or deferred, discipline was harsh, food meager and sometimes rotten, and clothing and shelter often insufficient. But for some men the army was a better and more dependable way of life.

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12 and 13 year old 'soldiers'.

Trained sharp shooting professionals by the age of 9 I bet.

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Marat (1742-1793)

A scientist and physician who set aside his trade as a doctor to serve as best he could in Revolutionary France.

It is pointed out that with his love of the people to guide him Marat was the only revolutionary leader who had a real understanding of events and power of grasping them as a whole, in their intricate bearings on one another. He foresaw what was to come, far better than any of his contemporaries.

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NOT a professional politician but still a major driving force in the French Revolution.

So suck it, Pierre.

You Should Have Voted Sanders But Have A Hug Anyway.

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French Revolutionary Army

Almost all of the ancien regime officer class had been drawn from the aristocracy. During the period preceding the final overthrow of the Monarchy, large numbers of officers left their regiments and emigrated. Between 15 September and 1 December 1791 alone 2,160 officers of the royal army fled France[1] eventually to join the émigré army of Louis Joseph, Prince of Condé. Of those who stayed numbers were either imprisoned or killed during the Reign of Terror. The small remaining cadre of officers were promoted swiftly; this meant that the majority of the Revolutionary officers were far younger than their Monarchist counterparts. Those high-ranking aristocratic officers who remained, among them Marquis de la Fayette, Comte de Rochambeau and Comte Nicolas Luckner, were soon accused of having monarchist sympathies and either executed or forced into exile.

Revolutionary fervour, along with calls to save the new regime, resulted in a large influx of enthusiastic yet untrained and undisciplined volunteers (the first sans-culottes, so called because they wore peasants trousers rather than the knee-breeches used by the other armies of the time). The desperate situation meant that these men were quickly inducted into the army young volunteers full of enthusiasm at the thought of dying for liberty.

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Again not professional troops, most serving out of love for what they hoped to be a better tomorrow not mainly for pay or pensions or rank.

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The French struck first, with an invasion of the Austrian Netherlands proposed by foreign minister Charles François Dumouriez. This invasion soon turned into a debacle when it was found that the hastily trained Revolutionary forces badly lacked obedience: on one occasion, troops murdered their general to avoid a battle; on another, troops insisted on putting their commander's orders to a vote. The Revolutionary forces retreated from the Austrian Netherlands in disarray.

In August 1792, a large Austro-Prussian army commanded by the Duke of Brunswick crossed the frontier and began its march on Paris with the declared intention of restoring full power to Louis XVI. Several Revolutionary armies were easily defeated by the professional Austrian, Hessian, Brunswick and Prussian troops. The immediate result of this was the storming of the Tuileries Palace and the overthrow of the king. Successive Revolutionary forces failed to halt Brunswick's advance, and by mid-September it appeared that Paris would fall to the monarchists.

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Yeah these guys.

Real professionals.

You Should Have Voted Sanders But Have A Hug Anyway.

"Are you daft?

American troops were not the professional troops the red coats were. These were mostly farmers and kids barely in their teens:"

But the thread wasn't about average troops, but leaders because the thread title is

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I hope this is the last time the US elect a bunch of amateurs

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"12 and 13 year old 'soldiers'.

Trained sharp shooting professionals by the age of 9 I bet."

I know you meant the sharpshooter comment in jest, but its actually more true than not.

Americans used a lot more rifles while the Brits used none.

Americans who did regularly shot used it for hunting, where accuracy against a moving target is the difference between starving or having food for a week. And yes, kids hunted as well.

The British civilians in London were horrified by the accuracy of American sharpshooters.

"NOT a professional politician but still a major driving force in the French Revolution."

Except he had been writing about politics since 1770 when you wrote about slavery. Furthermore, people of that were far better read than they are now. Marat himself spent a large amount of his time in the coffee houses discussing politics and governing. So not really an amateur.

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

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Louise-Renée Leduc, known as Louise Reine Audu, was a French fruit seller, known for her participation in the French revolution. She was counted as one of the Heroines of the revolution.

The 5 October 1789, she, alongside Theroigne de Mericourt, led The Women's March on Versailles. At Versailles, she belonged to the delegation allowed an audience with the monarch to put forward their complaints. She led the march back to Paris with the royal court in triumph. Afterwards, however, she was imprisoned in Grand Châtelet and Conciergerie. She was freed 15 September 1791 by the efforts of the Cordeliers and Louis-Barthélemy Chenaux. The 10 August 1792, she participated in the storming of the Tuileries Palace. She fought personally with the soldiers of the Swiss guard. She was honored with a sword by the Paris commune for her acts.

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She was a professionalfruit seller.

You Should Have Voted Sanders But Have A Hug Anyway.

Not a major leader, only took part of one delegation.

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

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In August 1792, she was involved in the storming of the Tuileries Palace. She fought with the Swiss Guard during this time and she was honored with a sword by the Paris commune for her bravery.

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A little more than just taking part of a delegation if she partaking in hand to hand combat.

I Am Going To Life Tap, Heal Me!

But she's not leading the fight, so irrelevant.

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

She was physically in the fight.

Not irrelevant.

I Am Going To Life Tap, Heal Me!

"She was physically in the fight.

Not irrelevant."

She did very little in the way of leadership, so no not relevant to the argument that amateurs are better than professionals in the government.

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

we aren't talking professionals in the government, we're discussing common everyday people who partook in revolutions.

we're talking people who took time from their lives and sometimes even gave their lives to take on a role in a revolution. amateurs looking to make changes.

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Sorry folks, but your experiment with an 'anti-establishment outsider' has failed.

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'anti-establishment outsider'.

I Am Going To Life Tap, Heal Me!

"we aren't talking professionals in the government, we're discussing common everyday people who partook in revolutions."

No, that's what you want to talk about but the thread title is 'I hope this is the last time the US elect a bunch of amateurs.'

'Go get an education, learn to talk you first language, lerarn to spell countries names' nidii-76417

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François-Noël Babeuf (French: [babf]; 23 November 1760 27 May 1797), known as Gracchus Babeuf,[2] was a French political agitator and journalist of the French Revolutionary period. His newspaper Le tribun du peuple ("the tribune of the people") was best known for his advocacy for the poor and calling for a popular revolt against the Directory, the government of France. He was a leading advocate for democracy, the abolition of private property and the equality of results.

The hardships endured by Babeuf during his early years contributed to the development of his political opinions. His father gave him a basic education, but until the outbreak of the Revolution, he was a domestic servant, and from 1785 occupied the office of commissaire à terrier, assisting the nobles and priests in the assertion of their feudal rights over the peasants.

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This guy was a professionalbutler.

You Should Have Voted Sanders But Have A Hug Anyway.