Fatal Attraction : The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

I never liked the way Dan killed Alex. I felt Dan was cruel and merciless to hold her down in the bathtub to drown.

Generally, we know that men can beat up women. Alex (as the antagonist) does not have any physical advantage over the protagonist Dan in any way. Basically, when Alex does bad things, Dan gets to beat her up and she cannot physically fight him back.

Typically, villains have a some advantage over the heroes in narratives perhaps strength in numbers, superior skills/advanced technology, etc. (Terminator/T-1000) (John McClaine/Terrorists) (Humans/Zombies); in this film, Glenn Close has no physical advantage over Michael Douglas. It's him who has the physical advantage over her. unless she's Michael fucking Myers, it made NO sense for them to have the climax be a brawl!

The drowning was not self-defense. After several seconds in water, he could see that Alex was weaker and clinging to life, but chose to hold her down until she died. Dan could have let up on her, while still restraining her, and had his wife call the police. He murdered her.

I don't care what Alex did. Alex is in a defenseless position here; Dan has an unfair advantage: he's using his man-strength to physically hold down a woman in water, where she is incapable of defending herself against his strength, and has no where to go but die a torturous death. At least if it were the wife who drowned Alex, they're at a level playing-field.

If we reverse the genders here, where Dan is a woman who cheats on her husband with another man who turns out to be the crazy obsessed stalker, we know that a woman could not physically hold down a man in water, nor would a woman go to her stalker's house alone at night to confront him. To use Michael Douglas's gender advantage as the channel in which to disable the antagonist was a cheap, tacky, and unfair way to end the film.

NEVER MIND THE FACT that Alex is PREGNANT. Dan didn't care that he was beating up and later murdering a woman, mind you, pregnant with a child, mind you, his own.

Dan is the villain here. He cheated on his wife and he beats up on women, pregnant ones.

Study your prey thoroughly, and choose only those who will prove susceptible.

Re: The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

Dan's wife killed Alex.

"My life is over. I might as well dance with Johnny Slash!"

Re: The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

Right, but Dan intended to kill her and thought he did kill her. He didn't know she'd pop back up for one jump scare like a slasher villain. For all intents and purposes he drowned her.

Study your prey thoroughly, and choose only those who will prove susceptible.

Re: The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

I felt sympathy for Alex, but sorry, I can't blame Dan for wanting to see her dead.

Besides, Beth had warned Alex that if she ever came near her family again, she'd kill her.

"My life is over. I might as well dance with Johnny Slash!"

Re: The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

And Beth killed her, as she had already warned Alex over the phone that if she came near her family again she would kill her.

Alex had trespassed, the affair was out in the open and the family had been put through hell, not only because of Dan's actions, but because of Alex's psychotic behavior.

She was ready to kill Beth and even Dan. She got what was coming to her and just as well for Dan's strength.

I'm not quite clear on what you are driving at. Close managed to give her character some subtle sympathetic qualities, yet by the end, she had just gone completely bonkers.

I wouldn't over think it. Alex ended up the bad guy.

Norman! What did you put in my tea?

Re: The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.



How did the OP expect Dan to react? It was kill or be killed and as I recall Alex was trying to stab Beth with a butcher knife.

"My life is over. I might as well dance with Johnny Slash!"

Re: The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

Its a confused post and the op appears to have misinterpreted the point. Why would Alex become the more sympathetic character, just because Dan was stronger? That is irrelevant and moot.

Did he want Alex to kill them all?

Norman! What did you put in my tea?

Bitch was bat shit crazy….

Bitch was bat shit crazy and deserved to be shot!



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Bitch was bat shit crazy….

She had to be stopped. She wouldn't even die in the bathtub and came up again like a screaming banshee.

It might have been representative of typical slasher killer origins who won't die, but in context of what was portrayed, there was no other option but to blast the bitch.

Norman! What did you put in my tea?

Bitch was bat shit crazy….

And even the audience cheered!



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Bitch was bat shit crazy….

One of the most fulfilling and satisfying movie endings ever.

I haven't seen Athena post in a while. Are they a Warren sock?

Norman! What did you put in my tea?

Bitch was bat shit crazy….

Yes it was!

No clue about Athena. I don't concern myself with socks. They're stupid, childish and cowardly imho.



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Bitch was bat shit crazy….

Skye has just commented on another FA thread about Dan tossing Alex around like a ragdoll, as females are more at a disadvantage.

Norman! What did you put in my tea?

Bitch was bat shit crazy….

I don't concern myself with socks. They're stupid, childish and cowardly imho.

———————-
I could not agree with you more. I waste enough time on here with just the one account!

I imagine it gets very confusing for some of these posters.

"Wait a minute! Who am I here?" - Jerry Blake

"My life is over. I might as well dance with Johnny Slash!"

Bitch was bat shit crazy….



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Bitch was bat shit crazy….

"Are they a Warren sock?"

Nah dude.
This is my one and only account.

I did switch names for awhile but then switched back to this one.
And that is the truth.

If I am on your block list, let me know!
Thanx.

Bitch was bat shit crazy….

I will believe ya!

I don't care for sock accounts, they can't be trustworthy. One could be on good terms with one and offside with another.

Thanks for letting me know.

Norman! What did you put in my tea?

Bitch was bat shit crazy….

If you see any old posts by a guy named Deluded Juice, that was me.

If I am on your block list, let me know!
Thanx.

Bitch was bat shit crazy….

I recall that name, but that was a while ago I think.

Thanks for your honesty.

Norman! What did you put in my tea?

Bitch was bat shit crazy….

You bet, bro.

And here is some more…

I was wordsatplaytoday on IMDb at the time it shut down so you also may see posts from that account in the faded font.

A couple of times I have chimed in as DJ and WP on a words started thread!
Just to troll but I don't think anyone has noticed or cares.

If I am on your block list, let me know!
Thanx.

Re: The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

It was self defense, and defense of his family.



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Re: The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

No it wasn't. A self-defense killing happens instinctively: you don't want kill the person, but you kind of have to, to save you or someone's death from possibly happening.

He held her down in bathwater by choking her and was self-aware about what he was doing: intending to kill her. She's being choked AND drowned at the same time, and there's nothing she can physically do about it but look up at wait for her death. That's a horrible way to go,

He already had her restrained.

Glenn Close is not a physically imposing woman in this. She's frail. She's not Sarah Conner or Black Widow. There was no physical threat. Thus, is it really fair that Michael Douglas gets to use his genetic advantage to put someone in a defenseless position until death? Especially when, if the roles were reversed, Glenn Close could not do the same to him?

Study your prey thoroughly, and choose only those who will prove susceptible.

It was self defense.

Yes it was. If he didn't kill her, she was going to kill him or one of his family. And no court in the land would convict him.



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Re: The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

There was no physical threat.
——————-
She was slashing him with a butcher knife, you stupid, stupid person.



"My life is over. I might as well dance with Johnny Slash!"

Re: The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

Technically, she was using the knife on him to defend herself from his initial attack charging at her for attacking her wife. Yes, she was intruding in his house and attacking his wife, but I want to distinguish that she never instigated a physical attack on him, any time she attacked him it was always to defend herself when he instigated one on her.

That aside,

He held her down in a bathtub to drown when it clearly was no longer self-defense, you stupid, stupid person.

At this point it becomes revenge and not defense:



He already has her in a chokehold. She's clearly not a physical threat to him so long as he can keep her immobile. He's already beat the shit out of her before.

She has to drown because she just happens to be a woman and he happens to be a man and she can't escape his chokehold transport to the bath. That's the only way this "death" could have happened.

A story is supposed to make the antagonist stronger than the protagonist, so that when the protagonist fights them and wins, it's seen as an accomplishment, and not as a act of bullying/domestic abuse/assault.

A lightweight should not have to die at the chokehold of a heavyweight.

This is from a previous altercation with her. He broke into her apartment and assaulted her.

You could say he was justified because she kidnapped the daughter prior to this, but regardless: 1) It's illegal 2) It's assault 3) It's breaking-and-entering 4) It's not self-defense.





Study your prey thoroughly, and choose only those who will prove susceptible.

Re: The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

Generally, we know that men can beat up women. Alex (as the antagonist) does not have any physical advantage over the protagonist Dan in any way. Basically, when Alex does bad things, Dan gets to beat her up and she cannot physically fight him back.
The point the movie is making is that you don't have to be violent to hurt people. Both Dan and Alex hurt each other through non-violrnt means.

The fact that a man will win a physical confrontation with a woman means that a female will use other means to inflict pain on her male enemy. Often, this hurts the man more. More even than death.

Check my block list because you're probably on it.

Re: The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

The point the movie is making is that you don't have to be violent to hurt people. Both Dan and Alex hurt each other through non-violrnt means.

The fact that a man will win a physical confrontation with a woman means that a female will use other means to inflict pain on her male enemy. Often, this hurts the man more. More even than death.

I agree with this 100%. Alex hurt Dan through her stalking and obsession. She even kidnapped the kid to take her out so she could feel like she's a part of the Dan's family. Dan hurt Alex through his not wanting to start a family with her.

This is why the ending didn't work for me: they chose the climax a physical brawl between Glenn Close and Michael Douglas. It doesn't work for this movie because Glenn Close does not a play an antagonist who has a physically intimidating advantage over the protagonist.

Michael Douglas was another similar movie called Disclosure where Demi Moore is the antagonist who falsely accuses Michael Douglas of rape and ruins his life. It'd be out-of-place for them to have a battle of the brawn and he throws her into molten steel, lol.

I just looked up the Roger Ebert review and saw this:


"Fatal Attraction" is a spellbinding psychological thriller that could have been a great movie if the filmmakers had not thrown character and plausibility to the winds in the last minutes to give us their version of a grown-up "Friday the 13th."


Study your prey thoroughly, and choose only those who will prove susceptible.

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Re: The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

I never had any sympathy for Dan, he was a horrible character who cheated on his wife with a mentally ill woman.

Bitch was bat shit crazy!

He was definitely a turd, but he didn't deserve a bat shit crazy bitch trying to kill him and his family.



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Bitch was bat shit crazy!

She didn't try to kill his wife until the end. The original ending is much better, and consistent with how her character was before this ending. They made her a slasher villain at the end, just so they could have the typical Hollywood ending.

Study your prey thoroughly, and choose only those who will prove susceptible.

Bitch was bat shit crazy!

But the point is she DID try to kill them. Bitch was bat shit crazy and had to be killed! It was either her or him, so it was self defense. The vast majority of people would have done the same thing.



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Re: The ending made me sympathise more w/ Alex than Dan.

He didn't know she was a loon. This was a gradual reveal. Don't you understand the film either?

Norman! What did you put in my tea?

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

Bitch was bat shit crazy and homicidal and just would NOT stop! She got what she deserved!



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

At least when she kidnapped the daughter, she took her to the amusement park and bought her prizes and food.

The daughter had a fun day, from her POV.

Worse things could have happened when someone kidnaps a child. At least hers was the best possible scenario involving an abduction.

The world would be a much better place if all child abductors did was take random kids to amusement parks and feed them and then drop them off back at home unscathed.

She didn't deserve to die, she deserved to be locked in a mental institution.

I prefer the original ending so much better, because it lets Dan off the hook from having to do anything in retaliation. Alex kills herself.

Study your prey thoroughly, and choose only those who will prove susceptible.

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

That's one of the dumbest things anyone has ever said on this silly board! How would you like it if she kidnapped YOUR child and took him/her to the amusement park?? Are you a moron or something?

And yes she deserved to die, because it was her or him, and he choose SELF DEFENSE! And I'm GLAD he killed her! She was a psycho bitch!



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

Do you think this person is fucking with us or are they really as retarded as they seem?

"My life is over. I might as well dance with Johnny Slash!"

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

That is an excellent question…right now I'm leaning towards him being retarded.



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

You're reading too much into that.

If you knew your child was going to abducted, would you rather the abductor take her to Disney World or would you rather the abductor molest and/or kill them?

Obviously, you'd hope the former.

Focus on what's literally being said here: You'd hope for the former OVER the other alternative. That says nothing about your stance on kidnapping.

Study your prey thoroughly, and choose only those who will prove susceptible.

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

Not gonna waste my time in a long, stupid debate with you on this. So buh bye!



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

The world would be a much better place if all child abductors did was take random kids to amusement parks and feed them and then drop them off back at home unscathed.

You have a distorted sense of perception and consequence. It does matter what they do, or where they take them, as it comes down to the "abduction" aspect and the rest is built around that.

If Alex had been caught when she brought Ellen home, (which is the biggest flaw in the film to me, because she just dropped her off at the top of her driveway after she was already alerted missing), Alex would have been arrested, locked up and very likely denied bail for this serious crime.

Don't forget, that Alex had already previously broken into their home and boiled Ellen's bunny which led to Dan's admission of his affair. That this crackpot whack job took out her obsessed frustrations by targeting an innocent party like Ellen, only proves what a psychotic nutcase she was. She had nothing in her favor going for her.

Dan dipped his wick earlier and Beth knew. She could have left him, or she could attempt to forgive him, though she wouldn't ever really trust him again.

Norman! What did you put in my tea?

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

Cheese, this person is just fucking with us! He can't be that retarded!



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

He can't be that retarded!
Yet that is what is being showcased here. They seem as nutty as Alex Forrest, especially as they express how they relate to her.

Norman! What did you put in my tea?

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

You may be right, Cheese. Perhaps they ARE that retarded!



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

If Alex had been caught when she brought Ellen home, (which is the biggest flaw in the film to me, because she just dropped her off at the top of her driveway after she was already alerted missing), Alex would have been arrested, locked up and very likely denied bail for this serious crime.

That's a very good point. Police would have been there.

I also don't like how the movie skips ahead in time after this: the next scene is Dan entering the hospital to see his wife, with the daughter there already, after already hearing about the accident and abduction off-screen. who took the daughter to the hospital? I wanted to see Dan and his wife's reaction to finding out Alex took their kid.


You have a distorted sense of perception and consequence. It does matter what they do, or where they take them, as it comes down to the "abduction" aspect and the rest is built around that.

I think you're inferring something different here. There are different levels of "evil." It always seems to be controversial when someone points out the evil a character won't resort to, as if this is somehow excusing the evil they did do, but it doesn't.

There's Harvey Weinstein evil, and Jeffrey Dahmer evil. Alex is somewhere in between.

She adducted Ellen, and she deserved to be prosecuted for that. She did for 1 or 2 reasons: 1) She was in a delusion that she still had a chance with Dan, and took Ellen out to feel like a part of the family, or 2) She knew it was over was passively-aggressively trying to get back at Dan.

The surprised look on Alex's face after Dan breaks in and assaults her, suggests the former. It was a look like, "You don't want to be with me after all, do you? I think I'm finally getting the hint."

At any rate, Alex's kidnapping was not pedophilia-related nor would she have skinned Ellen alive and wore her face as as a mask to get revenge on Dan. She's not on that level of evil.

If you have a choice between Alex taking your kid out and Leatherface obviously you're going to pick Alex.

That doesn't excuse Alex, mind you, but her punishment should be less harsh than one you would give, say, Michael Myers.

She had a worse death that Cary Elwes in Kiss the Girls (bullet through the milk cartoon), and he was a serial killer and rapist in that movie. And Cary Elwes raped and murdered the daughter of the guy who shot him. This is a guy who's death scene should've been much worse.

Compare to Alex, who (outside of the rabbit) murdered no one. Outside of being a clingy, deluded, lonely, wound self-inflicting, overly emotional, irrational, obsessive stalker, her big crimes were kidnapping, trespassing, and animal cruelty.

Study your prey thoroughly, and choose only those who will prove susceptible.

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

I think you're inferring something different here. There are different levels of "evil." It always seems to be controversial when someone points out the evil a character won't resort to, as if this is somehow excusing the evil they did do, but it doesn't.
There can be a perceived scale due to events that transpire, but what I am inferring, is that the abduction is the first and foremost aspect behind the crime committed.

Children should not be abducted, nor anyone for that matter, yet they are. Other people's behavior cannot be controlled in many instances, especially if they are mentally deranged like Alex. They are so obsessed and driven by their madness, they do not care about the consequence.


Compare to Alex, who (outside of the rabbit) murdered no one. Outside of being a clingy, deluded, lonely, wound self-inflicting, overly emotional, irrational, obsessive stalker, her big crimes were kidnapping, trespassing, and animal cruelty.
Your point seems to be, that due to some sympathy over Alex's circumstance, this somehow mitigates her behavior. She was mentally ill and unstable, yet it doesn't matter if she didn't murder a human, she broke into their house and "cruelly" killed a little girls pet, not to mention placed a huge threat over their own safety. She was unhinged.

She also went back to their home during the climax with the intention of murdering them. That implication is clear. She was stabbing at Beth who was in a cast and couldn't defend herself properly and slashed and stabbed at Dan.

In the original alternate ending, she may have been considered a little less intense as she killed herself in her own home. The theatrical ending telegraphs that there was another level to her psychosis and it made her a very dangerous woman where the lives of others were concerned.

Alex Forrest got what was coming to her.

Norman! What did you put in my tea?

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

And boiled the little girl's rabbit. Don't forget that part.

The world would be an even better place if people didn't abduct children at all.

"My life is over. I might as well dance with Johnny Slash!"

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

The world would be an even better place if people didn't abduct children at all.

Great post. Insightful.

My password is password

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

That poster is a either a moron or a troll, or both. Probably both.



😺 Schrodinger's Cat walks into a bar, and doesn't. 😠 Let's go, Brandon! 😎 Slava Ukraini!

Bitch was bat shit crazy…

Which part do you disagree with?

Study your prey thoroughly, and choose only those who will prove susceptible.
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