Politics : Scottish Independence is Lunacy, Folks

Then google SNP manifesto 2021 and click the links. I'm not here to spoon-feed you, Orson. I know how much of a wee stubby that would give ya.

I'll just ask again - No chance of what happening? You keep trying to context switch on me.

You are all over the place again, fella. The gaslighting might work on your fellow weegies but I'm way too smart to buy into it.


Try harder, neebs.

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Alba gu bràth

You’re off your tits . Just all over the place.

Allow me to state this unequivocally: Scotland voted no and there’s no chance of the decision being reversed, as evidenced by all recent polls showing plummeting support for it.

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Hep: "I'll post a topless picture if you do the same ;)"

If there is 'plummeting' support for it then why are the SNP still predicted to clean up?

Brexit has completely changed the landscape. I hope your bags are packed, neebur.

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Alba gu bràth

The SNP have secured another minority government, and all recent polls indicate a lack of support for independence.

It’s a busted flush, mate, and it’s embarrassing that you’ve sold your soul voting for a party which covered up rape.

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Hep: "I'll post a topless picture if you do the same ;)"

You guys lost, you should man up and accept it. You can't inflict a referendum that would have a huge impact on the whole U.K. every 5 years just because your side lost the outcome. That way lies madness - the idea of re-litigating BREXIT every few years, for example.

Give it another generation. You will probably win then.

The Scottish electorate can decide whatever the fuck it wants, whenever the fuck it wants.

You don't get to determine how a nation of 6 million is governed based on your notions of 'fair play'

The SNP has issued its mandate for this general election. The voters will decide. End of story.


Your squeals will go unheard.

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Alba gu bràth

and if you impose another disruptive referendum within a short number of years on the U.K., and win, don't be surprised when the English electorate makes their political class screw you to the wall in the post-referendum negotiations.

What's the hurry? You can continue to be characteristically dour, joyless and inebriated and yet still have England continue to pay for you for a good decade or two more.

It’s interesting that his hatred of the English is so strong that he’s willing to vote for a party that covered up sexual abuse.

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Hep: "I'll post a topless picture if you do the same ;)"

blinkers, my friend, blinkers.

The guy’s a marginally more intelligent version of Juan Kerr.

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Hep: "I'll post a topless picture if you do the same ;)"

Smartest thing they ever did here was after we had a referendum, and it was insanely close, 50..5 percent No to 49.5 percent Yes, was pass a Clarity bill. It obligated that the House of Commons determine if a referendum question was clear, and also determined what constituted a majority.

The separatists hated it, of course, and then their movement lost steam. And that says it all.

The SNP have no clear path for another referendum, particularly with their dwindling support.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2021/04/30/boris-johnson-prepared-take-snp-supreme-court-stop-second-independence/amp/

And even if another referendum was held, current polls suggest another clear win for ‘no’.

You’re definitely right that they should have bided their time. Immediately holding another referendum spits in the face of a clear democratic vote, and what with the party engulfed in sexual abuse cover ups and a leader attracting growing hatred, they’ve shot themselves in the foot massively.

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Hep: "I'll post a topless picture if you do the same ;)"

Quebec had the same choice, really: more political independence, which heck, feels great, but married with a probable economic downturn, which is not so great.

If the issue had been laid out honestly like that, I don't think anyone would have minded as much, but separatist politicians were pushing a snake oil story that with Quebec independence they would be freer, happier, richer, and their spouses would love them more - Nirvana, really,

when the rest of the country after the referendum said, no, you gotta be honest about it next time, the separatists were pissed. And again, that says it all.

Current polls show nothing of the sort.

Can you post a direct link to the poll and not to a tory-centric broadsheet?

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Alba gu bràth

That poll was a third party initiated by the Scotsman.

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Hep: "I'll post a topless picture if you do the same ;)"

What party are you voting for then?

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Alba gu bràth

What a total load of incoherent garbage. You are clearly out of your depth here.

… don't be surprised when the English electorate makes their political class screw you to the wall in the post-referendum negotiations

Negotiate what exactly? You are either clutching at straws or are too thick to understand what you are talking about

Did you mean negotiate over infrastructure?

Westminster will have no leverage at all over an independent Scotland. All the Scottish infrastructure - including the North Sea oil-beds - will instantly be under the rule of Holyrood. There is nothing to negotiate here.

Did you mean negotiate over border control?

Again… Westminster has no leverage here either. The north of England, a region which is closer politically to Scotland that it is to Westminster, trades heavily with Scotland. Any heavy-footed approach here would backfire on both countries. If Westminster tries to blockade Scotland there will be a politically push-back in the North. I'm going to guess that you are not from the UK? Your grasp of UK regional political climates is lacking.

Did you mean negotiate over currency?

This is the stickiest issue in the whole independence debate, in my opinion. But again, when you break it down, Westminster still has no real leverage. The pro-unionists will try to tell you that an independent Scotland has no right to use Sterling as their currency, with the Bank of England as their lender of last resort because Sterling is the UK currency. Which is a sound argument. But another sound argument is that an independent Scotland has no obligation to carry a share of accrued UK debt. So the UK can either continue to let us use Sterling as our currency until we are able to find an alternative (The Euro, for example) or they shoulder the entirety of the UK debt by themselves.

Did you mean negotiate over taxation?

This is a non-issue. You have wrong asserted above that England pays for us. Simply not true. The money given back to Holyrood by the UK treasury is determined by the Barnett formula. An independent Scotland simply redirects Scottish taxes from the UK treasury to its own treasury. Also, if you truly believe that Scotland doesn't pay its own way in the union… Then maybe you will be able to provide a better solution than the Barnett formula? Better men than you have tried in the past.

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Alba gu bràth

You are kidding yourself if you think that significant elements of defence, currency, the national debt, diplomacy, shared infrastructure, passports, and borders wouldn't be negotiated to one degree or another post-referendum, if the referendum were to carry the day. That's been the bread and butter of quite a bit of international diplomacy since the 18th century. You admit it yourself in your caveats in the post above, so let's not be disingenuous.

I can see you share the same 'like-pulling-teeth' style of debate as my retarded countryman Orson.

You stated:

when the English electorate makes their political class screw you to the wall in the post-referendum negotiations.

I was trying to extrapolate on your point here. I never stated that there would be no negotiations.

Maybe you could expand on how UK politicians can screw an independent Scotland to the wall?

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Alba gu bràth

First, just by entering into negotiations your fellow partisans and Yes voters will likely come to a rude awakening when they realize what would or could be on the table, because I sincerely doubt your independence politicians will articulate the full possible cost to the voters, ahead of the referendum. Why would they signal that by embarking on this path, some things in Scotland might be worse or atl least will be less certain?

Second, if the electorate in the rest of the U.K. believes that thieir interests are hurt or threatened by this, they' could give the government of the day the mandate to take a hardline stance in the negotiations with the SNP, on a number of issues. You understood this, you just wanted me to say that.

Much better argument than before. 7/10

TBC

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Alba gu bràth

So, ladies and gentleman, after a protracted vote, exercising that great and noble parliamentary tradition of division of the house, we can clearly see that the noes have it. An independent Scotland has been rejected by this magnificent institution. I'm proud of this mighty island of ours, once again. Thank you.

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Vote Conservative: Build Back Better

Haha, you destroyed him here. He had nothing.

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Hep: "I'll post a topless picture if you do the same ;)"

Excellent post.

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Hep: "I'll post a topless picture if you do the same ;)"

Giving Scotland independence is like giving a rapist a lifetime supply of chloroform and an invisibility cloak, it wont end well.

Hmm. I find this comparison logically questionable, but feel in essence it strikes the right chord. Thank you for introducing an awkwardness to the debate that I thought had disappeared with Corbyn's prime ministerial ambitions.

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Vote Conservative: Build Back Better

Here Orson, you been out for a pint since things reopened?

Who you talking to, bro? Boris? That's your illustrious leader. Show the man some respect!

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R. I. P. FFS (1975-2021)
Murdered by a Teutonic catfish

Not yet. I’m back in London tomorrow so might go out for beers if anyone’s doing anything.

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Hep: "I'll post a topless picture if you do the same ;)"