The Wicker Man : To people who criticize Howie trying to reason with the islanders…

they weren't going to kill him because of his religious beliefs. They weren't trying to convert him to theirs. So he's not rejecting a martyr's death and, therefore, a hypocrite. He was trying to reason with a bunch of weirdos who picked him for a ritual sacrifice based on various personality traits of his, not his religion. That's not a noble death honoring his beliefs. He's not defying his God by trying to have his life spared. What person - Christian or otherwise - wouldn't try to talk some sense into those people?

So people who seem to think Howie pleading with the islanders not to kill him is an affront to his religion don't really make sense. He was not a martyr, as Summerisle said. Martyrs are killed because of their beliefs. Howie was killed because he was a powerful virgin whom they'd successfully tricked (virgin/king/fool). While his virginity had to do with religion, there is no mention by the islanders that the virginity requirement of their sacrifice be based in Christianity. It's only required that the person be a virgin, whether that's because of their religion or because they're socially awkward or asexual, etc.

I think I'd plead not to be burnt to death.

The book that the script was taken from made much more of Howie releasing birds and animals as the flames crept towards him.

I suspect that some of the lost scenes may have included that.

Wow, that makes it even more sad. I haven't read the novel based on the movie, but I have read Ritual, which is the book the movie is actually (loosely) based on. Totally different story, other than a cop investigating a girl's death that may have been related to pagan rituals.

But as for my initial point, I just think it's silly that some people on this board try to say Howie's behavior at the end of the movie is supposed to paint Christians as hypocritical babies or something. He wasn't being sacrificed because he was a Christian, and who wouldn't try to convince a village of maniacs not to burn them to death, as you said?

Yes, I would be screaming my head off, begging them to let me go.
That does not mean I lost my religion I just don't want to be murdered!

People rarely get burned to death. The smoke inhalation does them in long before that.

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ososment wrote:


I think I'd plead not to be burnt to death.

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Absolutely: he was trying to stop their crime of murdering him, nothing to do with religion. He was begging for them to see reason, as society - his society - would see it.


Free your mind and the rest will follow

His religious views did come into play. He was a virgin because of his Christianity. That's the primary reason he was sacrificed. Also, Summerisle was blatantly vitriolic of Christianity.

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That's the primary reason he was sacrificed. Also, Summerisle was blatantly vitriolic of Christianity.

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neither of these things is true summerisle explains that howie was sacrificed in large part as a figure of authority (hence why he concluded summerisle himself would be the next choice for sacrifice if howie's sacrifice failed to restore the crop) and summerisle was smarmy and condescending but never "blatantly vitriolic" wrt christianity.

If he hadn't resisted Willow, they wouldn't have sacrificed him. He resisted her because of his beliefs. Also, it was clear Summerisle had a disdain for Christianity because of the sppech he made as Willow was preparing to seduce him. The crops were also a major part of it. They were all factors.

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If he hadn't resisted Willow, they wouldn't have sacrificed him.

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why not

Because he would not have fulfilled the criteria of their sacrifice "A man who has come here with the authority of a king, a man who has come here as a virgin, a man who has come here as a fool".

Howie's virginity and its link to his piety and devout christianity was vital to his nature as the perfect sacrifice. Take any of those things away and he would no longer have been perfect.

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Reality is the new fiction they say, truth is truer these days, truth is man-made

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Yes, but like I said:

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While his virginity had to do with religion, there is no mention by the islanders that the virginity requirement of their sacrifice be based in Christianity. It's only required that the person be a virgin, whether that's because of their religion or because they're socially awkward or asexual, etc.

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So I still don't think it can be said that the islanders specifically sacrificed him because he was a Christian.

I would have kicked Summerisle off the cliff and fought tooth and nail for my life before they got their hands on me. I would have figured I didn't have a hope of talking them out of anything.

Howie wasn't that kinda guy. He was a Christian and he really was trying to do what was right the entire film. The situation was hopeless by the end of the film so fighting off the crazies wouldn't have done him much good anyway.

this is the type of bad things that happen to ya when ya don't carry a machine gun

To me, the point of that scene was to show the ultimate irrationality of religion, yes, even Christianity. Christians are taught not to fear death if they follow all appropriate rules, which Howie seemed to have done. Yet he was still terrified, as many Christians are, of death. His religion provided him no life raft in that situation.

In fact, you could go so far as to say that many historic religions (again, even Christianity) become Howie's enemy at that point. He is trying to reason with these people beyond religion, begging them to think about what they are doing from a different, rational perspective, a.k.a. they are committing murder. However, from the islanders' perspective and by their religion, they ARE thinking. His pleas are falling on deaf ears. I believe such pleas put to Christian ears at moments in our history have met with similar insensitivity. Like in the Inquisition and witch trials, perhaps?

The point of the scene, to me, is to show the failure of our religions to reveal true morality and rationality. Your religion offers no true comfort and is no true friend at often the most pivotal moments of your life.

Wanna know what message I got from the movie? It's. A. Movie. Not a theological essay. It's a great, haunting story. That's it.

And will you people please stop bringing the inquisition and crusades into everything that slightly has to do with christianity? I and all the other christians alive today weren't even born at the time. Heck, not even our grandparents or great-grandparents were around. Do you blame all Germans for the holocaust, or all muslims for islam-related terrorism, even though those events are more recent? That's what I thought.
Normally I don't like to say such personal things in replies, but I'm sick and tired of being labeled a child-molesting, witch-burning judgmental *beep* simply because of my religion. A religion that has helped me through my darkest days, where I thought I would simply give up and kill myself.

Damn fine post!

Also, one fine point that bothers me about the island's "paganism"I so wished that it had been a survival of the real thing from primordial times. Instead, it's only a couple of generations old, a deliberate import from an apparent cynic/skeptic, whose only use for it was to lull the simple islanders into believing that their crops' success depended on the Old Gods. Of course, the director wants us to understand that the religion is, in its origins, itself bogus - it's not even authentic "paganism". The film therefore can be said to give more gravitas to Christianity as the older, more solid religion (except of course in the eyes of Summerisle's poor dupes).