Lincoln : Only entertaining for Americans.

Only entertaining for Americans.

So, I watched Lincoln last night and to my extreme disappointment, it bored the pants off me. How this film is being tipped to win the Oscar for best film, over such great movies as Argo, Amour and Django Unchained is beyond me. The fact that I had no previous knowledge of the subject matter, should have been irrelevant. I mean, I don't know much about Facebook, but I loved the Social Network. I didn't know who Jake La Motta was and yet Raging Bull blew me away. I didn't know anything about Christopher McCandless's life, but as a film, Into the Wild touched me and intrigued more than most others.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that the film fails on one main level. This is purely down to the fact that unless you are interested in American Politics, or are indeed American, Lincoln will struggle to hold your attention. This is a fault of how the film was made and due to the fact that it isn't accessible to people without any prior knowledge of the story, or of Lincoln himself. A good film should be able to captivate it's audience, regardless of what it is about. Shame on you Spielberg, shame on you.

Obviously some people who aren't American will love the movie and some Americans will probably hate it. On the whole though, I guarantee most of the positive reviews will come from Americans who know all about the 13th amendment, or whatever and most of the negative ones, will be from people who aren't American.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

"A good film should be able to captivate it's audience, regardless of what it is about."

A good comment on IMDB discussion boards should captivate the readers, regardless of what it is about.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that your post fails.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

Yes, true!
I am a foreigner and I loved this movie (not my favourite movie this year, that would be Les Mis, but still….). I found it intelligent and complex on many different levels.
What OP said, was just like HIS opinion.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

As a dutchman, second that!

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

Yea! I third that. I am a Canadian and absolutely loved this film! I was especially delighted to find that Spielberg had composed a scene in which Lincoln makes mention of Euclid's axioms. One of the few things I knew about Lincoln prior to watching this film: at one point he essentially put all of his legal studies on hold until he was absolutely certain that he understood the first principles put forth by Euclid. As a training scholar, it was one of those stories about Lincoln that fascinated me.

The only thing I probably knew about Lincoln prior to watching the film other than this was the fact that he was a major proponent in abolishing slavery in America.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

well said mr. smarty pants

give yourself a pat on the back again

Post deleted

This message has been deleted.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

You're such a jerk. If people on IMDb say they didn't like a film and give no reason, they get slammed and ridiculed. The OP gave a fairly long explanation as to why the film didn't work for them. Normal, mature people would reply and enter into further discussion about the movie. Not you. You give them the same treatment as the mindless trolls.

This site is for the discussion of films, not for fanboys to have little tea parties and man the turrets against all those nasty people that disagree with them.

Grow up.





'Then' and 'than' are completely different words and have completely different meanings.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

" This is a fault of how the film was made and not because I didn't have any knowledge of the films story. A good film should be able to captivate it's audience, regardless of what it is about."

I strongly disagree with your opinion - it is a certain attitude that people expect to be "entertained" once they paid for a ticket, no further knowledge/interest/activity recquired. I find that rather sad and think of a "good" movie a little different.
I believe it is a give-and-take kind of thing and at NO point anybody claimed that this film was something that it was not. In fact, Mr. Spielberg warned strongly against seeing this movie without having done any reading or having acquired some knowledge about the time/topics that this movie covers.

I speak as another non-American and I did A LOT of reading prior to seeing this movie. Once done, I enjoyed the many references and how important every single sentence was. I do, however, agree with you that if you are not American or do not have an upbringing that allows for a deeper insight into the topic, it WILL be difficult to follow and the important talk turns into "blah blah blah".

It doesn't exonerate a potential viewer from doing a little research, especially when they know that a movie covers a very condensed time of a view month in a life that has more than 16.000 books written about, don't you think?

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

I hear what you are saying and I understand how reading up on the subject prior to viewing the movie could enhance the viewing experience. However, I still firmly believe that in order for a movie to be considered great or to be put up for awards, or whatever, it should be accessible to your average moviegoer. It's fine if people who have knowledge of the films story enjoy it more than those who don't, because they get and understand all of the films little intricacies and references. Having said that, it still has to be watchable for those who don't have any prior knowledge of the narrative, which I personally don't think Lincoln is.

Take Argo for example, yeah it's a different genre and type of movie, but it succeeds where Lincoln fails, whereby it entertains people (like me) without any previous knowledge of the story. Ergo, in my opinion, making it a vastly superior film and one that can be watched and enjoyed by people all over the globe……. Except maybe not by Iranians or by a few disgruntled Canadians ;).

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

to be put up for awards, or whatever, it should be accessible to your average moviegoer

You're jesting, right? Movies "accessible to your average moviegoer" sufficiently award themselves already, by the money they make.

There's more than enough dumbed down popcorn films with mass appeal out there. That's why a lot of people yearn for something original and fresh, which this one was. And captivating as such, even without any prior reading.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

By average Moviegoer, I didn't mean the masses who like mindless action films or stupidly inept, cliched comedies etc etc…..What I meant is your average, reasonably intelligent man (or woman) in the street who may like to go to cinema at the weekend to watch an entertaining and informative movie, which Lincoln failed to be. I mean come on, Lincoln is made by Spielberg, a man who has made a career out of making movies for the masses. Lincoln is hardly an artsy over intelligent piece of work, that people will find hard to understand. It's just a movie that unless you're American, you'll find it hard to like or even care about.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

I am not American and I found the movie both clever and entertaining. It was well written and well directed, and the acting was amazing. I guess like with many things in life, there's no accounting for taste. But condemning a movie because you personally failed to be entertained by it seems short-sighted.

"That's a window, bird."

Post deleted

This message has been deleted.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

Lincoln

Argo

Zero dark thirty



no matter what won best pic..

the award was gonna go to american propaganda

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

The first sentence of your post was one of the most impressive and true statements i've read in this site.

The second one killed everything.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

Not quite, IMO, as Argo was an action movie that people of a certain age could get a hold of real quick. I agree - it was a fantastic film! But you do NOT want to hear the angry comments of people in their 20's. I went with a mixed bunch and while all the 35+ loved it, the younger once said they were bored to tears because everybody looked so "strange" and because they couldn't connect with the characters.

Same thing, if you ask me…

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

that people of a certain age could get a hold of real quick

Just another rescue op movie, amongst a plethora of those. After about 20 mins in my only question remaining was how soon it's gonna be over.

Post deleted

This message has been deleted.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

Why would I possibly want to move out of my mums basement?….It's warm down here and I don't have to pay rent, hence I don't need a job. Plus I get all my meals made for me.

Are you from Alabama? If so, just a few things I need to mention.

.Nascar Sucks
.Hilary for President
.Homosexuality is good.
.And finally, most importantly, God isn't real. Oh well, he actually is, although it's called nature. Remember one thing; Science can fly people to the moon. Religion can fly people into buildings.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.


Why would I possibly want to move out of my mums basement?….It's warm down here and I don't have to pay rent, hence I don't need a job. Plus I get all my meals made for me.


Yeah, I think this is the real crux of the problem here.

You are obviously (extremely) young, you have limited life experience and a 'boxed-in' world view, and yet you claim to be able to lay down the law when it comes to the opinions of others.

Even others who are outside of your own country.

I really don't think you're qualified to speak on behalf of anyone else in the UK, let alone those in America or other countries.


Are you from Alabama? If so, just a few things I need to mention..Nascar Sucks.Hilary for President.Homosexuality is good..And finally, most importantly, God isn't real. Oh well, he actually is, although it's called nature. Remember one thing; Science can fly people to the moon. Religion can fly people into buildings.


Yeah, yeah, yeah. You're trying to show off your anti-American, 'with-it,' cool-kid, 'Young Euro' cred. You think you're actually going to 'impress' people that way… https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/data.filmboards/images/emoticons/laugh.GIF" alt="laugh.gif">https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/data.filmboards/images/emoticons/laugh.GIF" alt="laugh.gif">https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/data.filmboards/images/emoticons/laugh.GIF" alt="laugh.gif">

Well, we've heard it all before. It's just…boring. https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/data.filmboards/images/emoticons/no.GIF" alt="no.gif">

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

Hahahaha….I don't really live in my mums basement, it's called sarcasm, you clearly don't have the intelligence needed to comprehend such a thing. And if nearly 25 is "extremely young", then thank you very much. As for the anti American comments, I was joking, get a grip, jeez.

Just because I have expressed my views about a movie that you don't agree with, doesn't mean I have limited life experience Lol. For a person of my age, I have good life experience. I have backpacked around South East Asia and Australia for 18 months and now have my own house a fiance and maintain a steady job. God knows why I feel obliged to tell you any of this, as you are clearly a sad insecure person, who feels the need to judge somebodies life on a post that they have made about a film on a website. Way to go you.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.


you clearly don't have the intelligence needed to comprehend such a thing. And if nearly 25 is "extremely young", then thank you very much. As for the anti American comments, I was joking, get a grip, jeez.


Ah – forget it, kid.

You fouled up, you made an ill-considered and nonsensical thread, and now everyone is tearing the living shyte out of you for it.

Just let it go.

I can see from the rest of your ranting post that you have brought the thread around to the REAL subject you wanted to talk about – yourself.

Sorry, but you're just not very interesting compared to Abraham Lincoln.

Just give it up and LET GO, for christ's sake. https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/data.filmboards/images/emoticons/no.GIF" alt="no.gif">

Post deleted

This message has been deleted.

Post deleted

This message has been deleted.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.


This is purely down to the fact that unless you are interested in American Politics, or are indeed American, Lincoln will send you to sleep.


Not an American and watched the movied, twice. Guess what I didn't fall asleep neither of the times. So, maybe it's just you https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/data.filmboards/images/emoticons/giveup.GIF" alt="giveup.gif">

'the last gleaming' killed my last bit of faith in Joss Whedon

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.


——————————————————————————–
This is purely down to the fact that unless you are interested in American Politics, or are indeed American, Lincoln will send you to sleep.
——————————————————————————–

Not an American and watched the movied, twice. Guess what I didn't fall asleep neither of the times. So, maybe it's just you


I'm in the UK, and saw this movie this afternoon in a packed multiplex theatre. The audience was entirely rapt throughout, and some even applauded at the end, so I have to disagree with the OP too…

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

And didn't you kind of feel as though, "Wow, Daniel Day-Lewis really is one of the world's greatest actors, if not the greatest"? I did. I've been a fan for his entire career, and he has never failed to astound me. In case you didn't know much about the real Lincoln, Day-Lewis got the voice and walk down perfectly.

We didn't exactly believe your story…we believed your 200 dollars.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

And didn't you kind of feel as though, "Wow, Daniel Day-Lewis really is one of the world's greatest actors, if not the greatest"? I did. I've been a fan for his entire career, and he has never failed to astound me. In case you didn't know much about the real Lincoln, Day-Lewis got the voice and walk down perfectly.

Yeah: I've admired him since "My Beautiful Laundrette", but this was just extraordinary. It really didn't feel like you were watching an actor performing a role at all - it was just Lincoln on screen…

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

I will agree with you on that, Daniel Day-Lewis was brilliant, just not brilliant enough to make the film enjoyable for me. I'd say that it was probably his second best ever performance, with Daniel Plainview in "There will be Blood" being his best. Now that is a great Movie.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

I will agree with you on that, Daniel Day-Lewis was brilliant, just not brilliant enough to make the film enjoyable for me.

Well, OK: that's fair enough. I don't think any reasonable person should criticize you for not enjoying the film, as it's a personal opinion.
However the key phrase there is "for me": going back to your OP, do you not think that many other people could enjoy this movie almost entirely because of Daniel Day-Lewis's performance alone, regardless of whether or not they're American, or whether or not they're familiar with the history?
(And BTW: I suspect that a lot more non-Americans are familiar - at least on a basic level - with the history of Lincoln, the ACW and the end of slavery than your OP suggests.)

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

Personally, I think prior knowledge of the subject is needed to enjoy the movie, which I believe to be wrong. Yeah, Daniel Day Lewis was amazing as usual but for large periods of the movie he may as well have been talking in Chinese, because a lot of what he was talking about went straight over my head. I consider myself to be a reasonably intelligent person, so surely it's the films failings that I didn't understand a lot of what was being said. All I'm saying is that I didn't think it catered for a global audience and that it was maybe too US-centric, which is understandable, since it's a film about American history. But it still brings me back to my point that, in the main, the movie will appeal to Americans more than other nationalities.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

Huh? https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/data.filmboards/images/emoticons/confused.GIF" alt="confused.gif">

Did you just say that "for large periods of the movie he may as well have been talking in Chinese, because a lot of what he was talking about went straight over my head," and yet earlier you claimed that it's "probably his second-best performance ever"????

If you were too bored to even absorb what he was saying, how can you even rate his performance on any scale?

I dunno. You accuse the film of being 'USA-centric,' but I think the real problem here is that you are 'self-centric.'

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

They are completely different things. His performance was great but he was constantly telling stories and making references that I personally weren't familiar with and therefore I didn't really understand what he was talking about a lot of the time. That wasn't Daniel Day-Lewis's fault and in no way did it detract from his performance.

If you are a non American and familiar with the "13th Amendment" and stories of Lincoln's past, then well done you. As I'am not and I don't believe the film was made in such a way that allowed me to learn and to understand the story in an informative and entertaining manner. Then that's why, for me personally, the film failed.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.


Then that's why, for me personally, the film failed.


Then why didn't you just admit that in the first place? https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/data.filmboards/images/emoticons/confused.GIF" alt="confused.gif">

Instead, you projected YOUR PERSONAL experience of the film onto the heads of practically everyone else in the world besides Americans.

And as this thread has proven in no uncertain terms, you were wrong.

Post deleted

This message has been deleted.

Post deleted

This message has been deleted.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

I'm a true blue Aussie woman, born and bred who's only knowledge of how the American political system is stuff half remembered from my high school days which was approx 20 years ago.

I saw the movie this morning with a good friend, and LOVED it.

Yes the politics was a bit hard to understand, as I was constantly comparing it to the Australian way, and I didn't know many of the politicians shown, but that aside, I didn't feel the urge to walk out or fall asleep.

I thought the costumes were magnificent,Daniel Day Lewis' acting was superb, and the locations great.

I'm just glad I'm not voting in the upcoming Academy Awards, because as a proud Australian, I'd want to vote for Hugh Jackman, but Daniel Day Lewis did such a wonderful job, it would be a real turmoil as to who got my vote. Same goes for Les Miserables and Lincoln. I'd probably end up flipping a coin!

Post deleted

This message has been deleted.

Post deleted

This message has been deleted.

Post deleted

This message has been deleted.

Post deleted

This message has been deleted.

Post deleted

This message has been deleted.

Post deleted

This message has been deleted.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

Hey cookiegiggles2, one last note and I'm through with you.

You know I checked your message history and after reading many of your messages it's apparent you meet the classic definition of a TROLL. A seemingly very unhappy one at that.

For someone who thinks I have too much time on my hands, you in fact have posted 22 messages in the last 5 days and 12 messages as of today in this thread alone in just the last few days. It seems you just like to see, what you think are, your own great writing abilities.

Almost all of your messages are rude, obnoxious, and lack any indication you have any idea of Internet forum etiquette or just plain ol' sociability. Do you get some crude sick satisfaction out of calling people names or being rude?

So try to cheer up and maybe get some outside help. Mental health care is income based so it will probably not cost you anything. I won't reply to you any more so maybe that will make you a little bit happier but I doubt it. You will just move on to someone else.

EDIT: I see you deleted your message after I deleted mine. Probably a good idea because it really made you look bad as they were quite embarassing. In fact the whole discourse with you was a waste of time because you will never change. Hopefully others will notice your troll and rude writings on almost 100% of your messages and also not reply to you anymore. I do hope you change your ways though.


****************************************
My DVD Collection: http://www.invelos.com/dvdcollection.aspx/jerryel">http://www.invelos.com/dvdcollection.aspx/jerryel

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.


Personally, I think prior knowledge of the subject is needed to enjoy the movie, which I believe to be wrong. Yeah, Daniel Day Lewis was amazing as usual but for large periods of the movie he may as well have been talking in Chinese, because a lot of what he was talking about went straight over my head. I consider myself to be a reasonably intelligent person, so surely it's the films failings that I didn't understand a lot of what was being said. All I'm saying is that I didn't think it catered for a global audience and that it was maybe too US-centric, which is understandable, since it's a film about American history. But it still brings me back to my point that, in the main, the movie will appeal to Americans more than other nationalities.



Lukeashnufc - I 100% agree with you and do feel that the only thing that kept me going to the end of this movie was the performance of DDL and in particular Sally Field.

Being from the UK, I have a very limited knowledge of American politics and Lincoln, except I've heard he was a rather good President who many people from America idolize for what he did.

With that having been said, I do like a good political drama because I believe politics is a fascinating culture which has gave us some truly unforgettable characters.

Take for instance in this case, the Netflix series House of Cards with Kevin Spacey. I love this show. Even though I don't understand roughly 70% of the dialogue concerning American politics, the story is told in a thoroughly entertaining way which keeps me interested in the main characters and their goings on throughout the series.

Lincoln to me, felt like a lot of screen test scenes, monologue after monologue, stuck together to cover this story. While everything about the film and it's production is great, I have to say I agree with the OP in the fact I should not be an American historian to get any such pleasure out of a film like this.



In the meantime Sir, may I suggest you avoid landing, on your head - Alfred Pennyworth

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.


will agree with you on that, Daniel Day-Lewis was brilliant, just not brilliant enough to make the film enjoyable for me. I'd say that it was probably his second best ever performance


It was 'probably his second-best performance,' yet you didn't find it 'brilliant enough' to 'make the film enjoyable' for you?

Something's odd there, something's off… https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/data.filmboards/images/emoticons/confused.GIF" alt="confused.gif">

Your statement practically contradicts itself.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.


And didn't you kind of feel as though, "Wow, Daniel Day-Lewis really is one of the world's greatest actors, if not the greatest"?


I do know this, this next time I read about Lincoln it's gonna be very hard for me not to picture Daniel Day Lewis in this Lincoln. Whether it's bad or good to do so. But I'm pretty certain I won't be able to help it. That's how good I think both he and this movie are.

'the last gleaming' killed my last bit of faith in Joss Whedon

Post deleted

This message has been deleted.

Re: Only entertaining for Americans.

Abraham Lincoln's high-pitched voice and awkward, workmanlike gait were well-documented in his lifetime by countless eyewitnesses, not to mention hundreds of friends and colleagues. Most historians mention these aspects of his appearance and attitude, along with his penchant for telling humorous anecdotes to illustrate the points of his philosophical arguments. A couple of notable examples are Garry Wills' Lincoln at Gettysburg and the book on which the film is based, Doris Kearns Goodwin's Team of Rivals.

We didn't exactly believe your story…we believed your 200 dollars.
Top